Hello All

[Pip]

I've been browsing this forum on and off for half a year now and just decided to post.

Here's a short version of my story:

I grew up in rural western New York. When I graduated high school I tried to get a typical minimum wage job, but could not get an interview anywhere. So I went to the local public college. I spent four years getting a degree in computer science, and on graduating last spring I moved to Silicon Valley for a job as a software engineer. Now I'm 23.

I like to live simply, although this sort of happened naturally -- I never suddenly decided to change my lifestyle. I go with no car and no smartphone. Living here it's quite possible to just bike, although I don't go many places. I'll rent a car for road trips sometimes. I could name all of my possessions. Perhaps I'll write up an inventory on here sometime and see if there's anything I can get rid of.

The cost of housing is extremely high where I live. I rent a bedroom in a house and save almost all the rest of my income. There's nothing that I would buy for myself if I had more money, so I am content in that way.

What I love most is going home to visit my family and friends that I spent the first 22 years of my life with, and being out in nature which I find incredibly beautiful. We live in such a beautiful world! Unfortunately while in college I was too busy working on my academic/career success that I pretty much ignored nature -- but once college was over I really fell in love with it. Going home and visiting nature are difficult things to do given where I live now. I have to fly across the country to go home, and I have to drive through bad traffic to get out to nature. I have been taking advantage of being out west to visit lots of places out here that I'll probably never see again if I move back east.

I miss a lot of things about home. The people first, of course, but also the green summer, woods and creeks, clouds and beautiful sunrises and sunsets, real interesting weather and storms. The bay area in california has almost constant "good" weather with full on sunshine 3/4 of the time -- while I admit this is nice for being able to go outside everyday, it's not very interesting and seeing the same thing every day gets old. I enjoyed walking in the rain and snow. Anyway, I don't mean to complain.

I cannot imagine having a family in the suburban sprawl here. There's no wilderness for kids to play in like I had growing up. There are little parks and playgrounds, so I guess you can ride your bike and be out in the sun. But not much room for creativity, most of the stuff we did when I was a kid would get you in trouble here if it was even possible. Having to drive through crazy traffic to get anywhere would be rough too. But I digress. Suffice to say I don't really like the idea of living here the rest of my life. :)

I realize I'm extremely fortunate, and I don't want or intend to just enjoy my material success such as it is on my own. I have no more career aspirations. I got my "dream job" already, and I don't really feel the desire to climb the career ladder. (Not that I'd avoid promotion, but I won't compromise on anything else for that purpose, so it's not likely to happen.) I want to use my resources for something good but I haven't figured out what and I'm kind of afraid of making the wrong decision there, so the default thing is just to save and invest.

I don't know what to do next. I could live as I am now for another 20 years easily, saving lots of money and living a comfortable if simple life alone. Many people do that here. I certainly don't want that, so I will have to draw the line at some point and do something different even though it will mean cutting my income. I hope I muster up the courage to do that sooner rather than later. I think about moving back east sometime next year to be closer to home despite that it would set me back career-wise.

Maybe I'll pitch in on some of the discussions here, though I have more to learn than to teach, I think.

[awakenedsoul]

Hi StellersJay, Welcome to the forum! I believe there are West Coasters and East Coasters. Maybe you are just an East Coaster at heart? I would follow your passions, explore your options, and get out and meet people! You are young and successful. I hate to hear you saying you could live a comfortable yet simple life alone, (unless that's what you want.) I do that, so I'm no knocking it. But, at your age, the world is your oyster. There's so much to see and do, you aren't tied down with a family, a house, etc...

Have you been to Lake Tahoe? That's a gorgeous spot in nature. Huddart Park (sp.?) is also pretty close to you, and very pretty. Being out in nature is so important. Each place has its drawbacks. When I was working in Reno, I surrounded myself with houseplants and went horseback riding at my friend's several days a week. Maybe you can find something that that works for you...

[gimmethesimplelife]

Hi and welcome! You really sound to me like you have your head screwed on right at the age of 23 - wish I'd seen things this clearly at that age! You'll find great people and good advice here so enjoy. Rob

[cdttmm]

Hi StellersJay and welcome to the forums! I grew up on a farm in the upper Midwest and now live in a quasi-rural part of New England. I am a huge nature lover and enjoy living somewhere that has all four seasons so I can fully appreciate why you might not want to live your entire life in the Bay Area. But, while you are there, definitely take advantage of some of the fabulous natural beauty that you can only find in the western part of the United States.

I have to say...I'm very impressed that you figured all this stuff out by the age of 23 and that you are already living simply and saving your money. I look forward to reading your posts around the forums so thanks for joining us!

[Aroha]

Hi, lots of good reading and stimulating discussion around here, welcome aboard.

[SteveinMN]

Welcome, StellersJay! I'm looking forward to your input on what goes on around here; there's a lot to learn and I hope you feel comfortable contributing as well.

A couple of notes:


I cannot imagine having a family in the suburban sprawl here. There's no wilderness for kids to play in like I had growing up. There are little parks and playgrounds, so I guess you can ride your bike and be out in the sun. But not much room for creativity, most of the stuff we did when I was a kid would get you in trouble here if it was even possible.
I grew up in a suburb of New York City. No, there wasn't much "wilderness". But I and millions of others managed to grow up to be healthy contributors to society. :) Not knocking how you grew up; just that there are plenty of ways to exercise creativity and burn off energy even if it isn't in the woods or the mountains. My favorite was the beach.


I realize I'm extremely fortunate, and I don't want or intend to just enjoy my material success such as it is on my own. I have no more career aspirations. I got my "dream job" already, and I don't really feel the desire to climb the career ladder. (Not that I'd avoid promotion, but I won't compromise on anything else for that purpose, so it's not likely to happen.)
Where I used to work, I once heard a manager claim that he viewed with suspicion any one who wanted to hold the same job for 4-5 years (or more). His attitude was more widely held than I suspected.

I never saw anything wrong with perfecting one's skills at one job (especially now that work changes so quickly anyway). I know well there's a difference between 10 years of experience and two years of experience gained five times. I would just urge you to make sure that your satisfaction with your current job not be interpreted as a lack of ambition or an aversion to change.

[Float On]

Hello and welcome! What a great introduction. You are doing so many things right at such a young age.

[Tussiemussies]

Hi and glad to have you here. Looks like you have a lot of things you can share with us. I think you will really like it here! Chris

[Selah]

Welcome, StellersJay! Boy, I sure wish I'd had my head screwed on straight as much as yours is when I was 23! You have terrific values. If you aren't reading Mr. Money Mustache's blog already, I suggest you visit it, pronto. (And keep posting here with us, of course!) There are many ways to approach simplicity, frugality, and financial independence, and the journey can be a lot of fun and full of experiments and learning. Welcome again! :) Selah

[Gardenarian]

Hi there - I love your name.
I live a bit north of you, on the peninsula, but I have a cabin in the Santa Cruz mountains. There are amazing trails, creeks, redwood forests, and just wide open spaces there - only thirty minutes or so from silicon valley (if you have a car. It's a pretty steep ride up to 35/Skyline on a bike!) There is a lot to appreciate around here. I'd give it a chance. (Though I also dislike the congestion and this drought is making everything even uglier.)

I lived in the Boston area for a long time and just got back from a visit to the Cape. So green - wonderful to get caught in a rain storm. But I don't miss the conventional attitudes one bit.

[Pip]

Thank you for the welcome everyone.


I grew up in a suburb of New York City. No, there wasn't much "wilderness". But I and millions of others managed to grow up to be healthy contributors to society. Not knocking how you grew up; just that there are plenty of ways to exercise creativity and burn off energy even if it isn't in the woods or the mountains. My favorite was the beach.Yes, true, I probably have a bias toward my own experiences. I've seen the lives of some kids here, and unless their parents drive them somewhere or take them to the park, they have to stay in the house at all times. They still can turn into healthy contributors to society, but they're missing something that I am glad I did not miss. Where I grew up, until computers started taking over we were outside on our own pretty much every day. I'm sure it differs from place to place in the bay area, this is just what I've seen in the area where I live right now.


Have you been to Lake Tahoe?I was just up there this weekend actually. Tahoe is nice but crowded on the weekends. My favorite place in CA so far has been the trinity alps -- beautiful region without the crowds. In the west in general so far I liked the mountains of Idaho the most, which I was fortunate enough to visit a few weeks ago. Swimming in the big rivers there was the best.


I would follow your passions, explore your options, and get out and meet people!
I don't know how to meet people, at least not people who have much in common with me. I don't mean that in a "I'm-superior" way.. we are all different and there's nothing wrong with that. :) I suppose there are a lot of things I might do if I had a car, but not enough that I could justify the cost. One problem is that most things people do I do not particularly enjoy. While I can be happy anywhere among friends, it doesn't make sense to try to make friends initially by engaging in activities that you don't care for otherwise. For instance, the typical things people do -- bars, restaurants, concerts, movie theatres, all kinds of fancy activities that cost money, just don't appeal to me. I'm content just talking or walking, or being anywhere in nature. So, hiking trips basically are the thing for me to do, and I've done a lot of them and made one good friend out here so far.


There are amazing trails, creeks, redwood forests, and just wide open spaces there - only thirty minutes or so from silicon valley (if you have a car. It's a pretty steep ride up to 35/Skyline on a bike!) There is a lot to appreciate around here.I don't deny there is a lot of wonderful nature nearby. Particularly in the winter, short as this last one was. (I don't have a car though, so I don't get to be out in it as often as I'd like.) In a sense I'm afraid to love it too much because the more attached I become here the harder it would be to leave, and I do love my family to the point that I would hate to only see them a few times a year the rest of my life, and I will have to choose between the two sooner or later. A great dilemma to have, but I think humans are least happy when having to choose between giving up one of two things. So I've convinced myself that as far as nature goes, the east is as good as the west for my taste.

I should change my name on here. While I like it it's awkward to say and impossible to abbreviate. (I had been watching a Steller's Jay in the woods Saturday before I signed up..) Doesn't seem like this forum lets you change your name though, can an admin do that or would I need to register again?

[Alan]

I should change my name on here. While I like it it's awkward to say and impossible to abbreviate. (I had been watching a Steller's Jay in the woods Saturday before I signed up..) Doesn't seem like this forum lets you change your name though, can an admin do that or would I need to register again?
Send me a private message with your desired name and I'll change it for you.

[SteveinMN]

Yes, true, I probably have a bias toward my own experiences. I've seen the lives of some kids here, and unless their parents drive them somewhere or take them to the park, they have to stay in the house at all times. They still can turn into healthy contributors to society, but they're missing something that I am glad I did not miss. Where I grew up, until computers started taking over we were outside on our own pretty much every day. I'm sure it differs from place to place in the bay area, this is just what I've seen in the area where I live right now.
Again, not to be argumentative, but I think you may be conflating a few effects with causes.

City kids who are now my age certainly had no problem going to the park by themselves (when they were old enough, of course) or entertaining themselves. The current popularity of "helicopter parenting" and 24x7 wall-to-wall media coverage of child abductions, I think, makes many parents less willing to let their kids out of their sight. (When I was a kid, "Amber alert" meant you found a pretty orange mineral in the dirt.) That's an issue, but it's not a matter of where one grows up.

And the computer-as-entertainment-and-social-connection thing is by no means limited to (sub)urban kids. It's how younger people communicate. Again, not saying it's good or bad (IMHO it's both). But ten years ago, kids were not toting aroud smartphones or texting hundreds of times a month. We grew up under different circumstances.

I'm not saying there is no value to kids to growing up in a place in which you could go where you wanted to go among a variety of physical experiences or that unsupervised time among kids is a bad thing. I'm not arguing against social media, either. Just saying that I think the geography you reference is only loosely correlated (if at all) with the norms you're seeing now.

[Rosemary]

Welcome!
I'm an engineer and spent 10 years in the semiconductor industry in the Southwest before moving "home" to the upper Midwest (I grew up on the east coast... but this is my right place to be). I know what you mean about the repetitive perfect weather. I really, really missed the sound of leaves in autumn; the smell and sound of rain; and snow. So happy to have 4 seasons again.

One thing I used to do when I was in the Southwest was pick some wooded, mountainous place to hike with friends every weekend. It really helped me deal with the week in the low desert. It sounds like you don't have a large social network - if you like being outdoors, look for groups sponsored by organizations such as the Audubon Society or Sierra Club, or even businesses such as REI.

It sounds like you are asking yourself the right questions, thinking seriously about what you want. Something to consider: Some industries are still more friendly toward more recent grads and younger workers, and it's also easier to make a lateral or upward move for those at lower-level positions vs management or senior engineering.

[Alan]

StellersJay's username has been changed to Pip.

[Pip]

You make good points Steve. I've always been one to pick apart others' conflation of issues but when I'm the one conflating it's less obvious to me. :) I still think there are different possibilities growing up in a rural vs suburban/urban sprawl. For instance, "when they were old enough" does change. Us kids were playing outside together at ages 3-10 without supervision -- and I wouldn't do that in a place where there are cars driving by 20 feet from the house, and so many strangers nearby that you can't possibly know them all.

However, there are a lot of specific issues we're talking about, and you can break it down and have some without the others almost anywhere in the US, and the biggest factor is probably the parents, not the environment.

Sent you a PM, Alan. Thanks

[SteveinMN]

You make good points Steve. I've always been one to pick apart others' conflation of issues but when I'm the one conflating it's less obvious to me. :) I still think there are different possibilities growing up in a rural vs suburban/urban sprawl.
Absolutely. :) And both have their good points and bad points. Viva la difference!