View Full Version : Trump hostility to the environment
In office in 4 days, and here are his "accomplishments":
Announced reduction of 75% of the current corporate regulations, which include environmental protections
Signed an executive order granting approval of the Keystone Pipeline
Somehow intimidated the CDC into canceling its climate change summit next month (not saying it was direct intimidation, but apparently they were worried about how the administration would take it)
Ordered a media blackout at the EPA and suspended grants
So, when I was complaining to DH, he was saying that we don't know how Trump is going to be with the environment--maybe he'll be fine, and I had to remind him that this was the man that sued Balmedie, the town in Scotland that let him build a golf course there, because he objected to the wind farms. Thankfully, he lost that fight.
>:(
iris lilies
1-24-17, 3:38pm
I think there is way too much "awfulizing" a Trump presidency, and the many items already posted on social media are small, instubstantial things blown out of proportin.
However, being a friend to the environment is not his priority. So yeah, if decisions come down to environment vs. Something Else, I doubt that the environment will win.Your overall concern is legitimate.
I agree about the sensationalizing this election outcome, IL, and I'm ready to go on a media fast--well, at least a FB fast. I'm tired of seeing my liberal and conservative friends duke it out with anti-Trump/anti-Liberal meme after meme after meme. It's getting VERY tiring.
But, yes, I'm afraid that the planet will not get much attention from this administration.
I think there is way too much "awfulizing" a Trump presidency, and the many items already posted on social media are small, instubstantial this blow out of proportin.
I think you're right that the cottage industry of finding new things to deplore about Trump may be expanding beyond the zone of even American-politics rationality. The good people at Slate are publishing articles with headlines like "Donald Trump's Horrifying Signature is a Cry for Help", "A Detailed Forensic Analysis of Melania Trump's Creepy, Devastating Inauguration Smile/Frown" and "How Long Would a Liberal Have to Cry to Fill a Mug With Tears?".
I like your use of "awfulizing". "Demonizing" has been overused to the point of cliche.
How can anyone NOT be concerned? We're already seeing so much damage to the planet, even with the laws in place to protect it (weak as they are). I would venture to say that people who aren't concerned about it, aren't really aware of things.
Being a person who lives out in the country, I'm seeing it up close and personal. I'm barely seeing butterflies/birds/animals like I used to. And most woods around here are sick. Farmland and lack of concern for wetlands is making for lots of problems. Even if we did everything right for the environment, man is destroying so much, just with population. I can only shake my head when people say the concern for the environment is over-blown. So sad. I'm wondering if those people don't have children......
ApatheticNoMore
1-24-17, 4:25pm
Also advancing the Dakota access pipeline apparently.
Yea, it's hard to get news that isn't hysterical, but going back and forth about what is hysterical based on whether people have strong emotions is NOT rational either. So take a step back and ask: 1) is this actual policy (Trump being a jerk on Twitter, inauguration counts don't count). 2) Is this something Trump actually has the power to do? Remember some things still require Congressional approval, now you can be as pessimistic about the current Congress as you like and it's probably well founded! But some legislation is not actual law until it gets both that and Trumps ok is all I'm saying. 3) Does it represent a change of policy? Some of the bad policy under Trump will be pre-existing bad policy, occasionally pre-existing bad policy might be reaffirmed. 4) what is the likely effect?
Now executive orders and authority over government agencies are where Trump actually may have some power sad to say! :(.
Chicken lady
1-24-17, 5:15pm
It is making me emotional and literally crazy.
i am trying, and often failing, to change a lot of ingrained behaviors (see mindful consumption thread) and I feel like no matter what I do, it's bailing a sinking ship with a spoon.
every other issue I care about, I feel like "well, this will probably suck, but it can be fixed later." The environment I don't think we can fix later.
It is making me emotional and literally crazy.
i am trying, and often failing, to change a lot of ingrained behaviors (see mindful consumption thread) and I feel like no matter what I do, it's bailing a sinking ship with a spoon.
every other issue I care about, I feel like "well, this will probably suck, but it can be fixed later." The environment I don't think we can fix later.
I hear ya Chicken lady. Unfortunately, I'm to the point where the only consolation I can find is thinking "Nature will endure without us." It may take a long time to recover, but it will happen.
Chicken lady
1-24-17, 5:24pm
My friend told me "the planet will be fine. It's the current cast of life forms that won't. Stop being so human-centric. The cockroaches have waited a long time for this."
I hear ya Chicken lady. Unfortunately, I'm to the point where the only consolation I can find is thinking "Nature will endure without us." It may take a long time to recover, but it will happen.
I know, Cathy. That's the argument I hear, also. But millions of years to establish such miraculous biodiversity and maintain a perfect ecological balance, and in a mere hundred years or so we're overfished, overfarmed, overpopulated, over-consumed. We've poisoned streams and rivers, killed off the Coral Reef, killed off tens of thousands of species every year, eroded our topsoil.
Yes, it will return, but it seems like such a waste. It's like when we spend money foolishly and my husband's mantra is "ah, money comes and money goes," which makes me so mad because usually when it "goes" it's because we've been stupid. Same thing with the environment. We're saying, "Ah, planets come and planets go" instead of saying, "we're being stupid."
Yes catherine, it IS such a waste, and it makes me so sad. What a beautiful planet........that had perfect balance in every way. I sometimes almost wonder if man WAS put here by aliens, since he doesn't seem to belong. We're throwing ourselves out of the garden of Eden....but only after destroying it. We've lost all balance.
I found this article and it reminds me of balance, and how quickly it can be destroyed with just one act. But where man is concerned, it's just not that simple anymore, to get it back again. Like the old saying about the ripple of one drop of water in a pond.....
https://weloveanimals.me/released-14-wolves-park-no-one-prepared-unbelievable-nature11/
None of it comes as surprise to me. He can only do so much by executive order, but it looks like he is doing a lot and I doubt congress is going to give him too much of a fight. I was reading that it's not just the EPA, but there have been crack downs on communications among many departments like the FDA, the USDA and NIH. I don't know if it's out of fear or some other control mechanism.
No doubt the planet will out survive us humans, but I fear for the next few generations. Not just from environmental catastrophes and hardships, but being robbed of the inspiration and spiritual connection to the beauty of things we should be the stewards of.
[QUOTE=Rogar;261600.....No doubt the planet will out survive us humans, but I fear for the next few generations. Not just from environmental catastrophes and hardships, but being robbed of the inspiration and spiritual connection to the beauty of things we should be the stewards of.[/QUOTE]
How very true! :(
flowerseverywhere
1-25-17, 7:18am
I am not surprised. He is doing things he said he was going to do. He said during his campaign he did not believe in global warming. He said he was going to lift regulations to make it easier for business to thrive. Muslim immigration ban and registry is next. The wall is being announced today. His first deeds were to start to whittle away at abortion, foreign aid and the ACA. He is working non stop to do exactly what he said he was going to do and I am guessing he is working his staff half to death. Every president tries to advance his own agenda, but I do not think any president in modern history has been so swift and decisive. Any executive action that can be taken will be. Political correctness and any worry about re election be dammed.
Well, Trump has a mental disorder. His view of reality is skewed. He shows this every day, and he has shown it from the beginning of his candidacy. He lives in his own reality, and will not consider anything else but what he believes in that reality of his. Every one of his comments and decisions comes from his mental disease. We can only hope enough of the republicans can see this and oppose him whenever possible, for the sake of the country and the world. He is the Pied Piper to those who are either greedy, or can't sense his inconsistencies/mental disease.
Ultralight
1-25-17, 8:21am
Well, Trump has a mental disorder. His view of reality is skewed. He shows this every day, and he has shown it from the beginning of his candidacy. He lives in his own reality, and will not consider anything else but what he believes in that reality of his. Every one of his comments and decisions comes from his mental disease. We can only hope enough of the republicans can see this and oppose him whenever possible, for the sake of the country and the world. He is the Pied Piper to those who are either greedy, or can't sense his inconsistencies/mental disease.
"A troubled man for troubled times!"
frugal-one
1-25-17, 8:57am
So SICK of the trump era already! Saw this morning that there is proof of election hacking by the Russians here in WI! ... of course... Democrats. Also saw there is going to be a media coverage problem... as mentioned above. VERY scary indeed!
Williamsmith
1-25-17, 9:23am
Just observations:
This is war. It is not politics.
It is the heartland versus the avant-garde for social, cultural and economic values.
Anyone who has entered into a struggle knows to beware of diversions.
The arts, the elites and their followers.... the enlightened progressives are expending time and energy on their own Pas-de-Calais while the real invasion is already taking territory.
There will be no retreat. Trump will not pay twice for the same real estate.
He has drawn some out into the open where they may be slaughtered.
There is a great struggle going on. The progressives are on the bottom and they were not prepared to mount a proper defense. They have been taken to the mat and have ceased to score points.
Every day they make critical mistakes and are convinced a breakthrough is on the horizon.
Trump will continue at will until his opponent finds leadership. Who is that? Their last leader is having his legacy dismantled at a frightening pace. It is true. "All glory is fleeting."
It appears President Trump has read "The Art of War" by Sun Tzu. Quote :
"A general is skillful in attack whose opponent does not know what to defend; and he is skillful in defense whose opponent does not know what to attack."
Trump will not pay twice for the same real estate.
No. He'll declare bankruptcy and stiff his creditors.
So SICK of the trump era already! Saw this morning that there is proof of election hacking by the Russians here in WI! ... of course... Democrats. Also saw there is going to be a media coverage problem... as mentioned above. VERY scary indeed!
I heard that too, although I hadn't heard there was concrete proof yet that Russian intelligence services had hacked the web site of the Democratic Party of Winnebago County. That would certainly be taking meddling down to a very granular level.
frugal-one
1-25-17, 12:13pm
Also, interesting that Trump is now allowing the pipelines to go through. Heard that he is invested in one of them. He really has conflicts of interest! His family may be running the business now but he still knows what he has. He will just get richer.
Don't we have any laws to stop him??
Don't we have any laws to stop him??Stop him from what? Approving a pipeline that was already approved at every level of government up to and including the State Department?
"Trump will continue at will until his opponent finds leadership. Who is that?" from WS's post on previous page.
WS, has it occurred to you that this leader will come from the GOP or one of Trump's appointees?
Stop him from what? Approving a pipeline that was already approved at every level of government up to and including the State Department?
I meant stop him from everything. You're an intelligent person Alan, surely you see him as a crazy man too?
Don't we have any laws to stop him??
As of December the pipeline was under environmental review. It's construction was halted while the review was completed. If the Corps of Engineers reverses it's decision to wait until the completion of the environmental review, it's legality would be questioned. There are still some legal battles but since Trump basically owns the environmental agencies through right or might he may get his way. At this point he's merely signed a memorandum basically asking to re-open everything for review.
In the big scheme of things, it might be mostly symbolic. If increased carbon emissions are facilitated by the pipeline, it will be in the shadow of other environmental policies in the works like increased use coal energy and reduction or elimination of auto efficiency standards. The other environmental issues are more local and involve eminent domain and the possibility of leaks or spills.
So technically there are laws, but practically it may not matter.
I meant stop him from everything. You're an intelligent person Alan, surely you see him as a crazy man too?
"Crazy" is a technical term. Has he been observed and diagnosed? What sort of due process was followed for declaring him "crazy"?
Yes catherine, it IS such a waste, and it makes me so sad. What a beautiful planet........that had perfect balance in every way. I sometimes almost wonder if man WAS put here by aliens, since he doesn't seem to belong. We're throwing ourselves out of the garden of Eden....but only after destroying it. We've lost all balance.
I found this article and it reminds me of balance, and how quickly it can be destroyed with just one act. But where man is concerned, it's just not that simple anymore, to get it back again. Like the old saying about the ripple of one drop of water in a pond.....
https://weloveanimals.me/released-14-wolves-park-no-one-prepared-unbelievable-nature11/
Sorry it's taken me so long to reply--I'm on a tight report deadline and I wanted to re-watch this video before replying. I've seen it before--in fact, I subscribe/follow SustainableMan.org/SustainableHuman.org. Chris Agnos, the website's owner, has a ton of content very relevant to a lot of my interests and beliefs, and he's a very talented videographer/film-maker as evidenced by this video. I recommend following Sustainable Human on Facebook if you don't already.
This is a perfect example of balance in the eco-system! Thanks for posting it. I hadn't seen it in a while.
I meant stop him from everything. You're an intelligent person Alan, surely you see him as a crazy man too?Everything? That's a tall order.
I don't see him as crazy, I do see him as odd, different than any other politician we've seen at the National level, but that seems to be the very quality that got him there. I think we should give him a chance to actually do something before we let our emotions get the better of us.
Part of me thinks there may have been a certain degree of prescience displayed in the choice of his constant campaign musical backdrop of the Rolling Stones "You Can't Always Get What You Want" (but if you try sometimes you just might find, you get what you need).
Part of me thinks there may have been a certain degree of prescience displayed in the choice of his constant campaign musical backdrop of the Rolling Stones "You Can't Always Get What You Want" (but if you try sometimes you just might find, you get what you need).
As long as we don't get what we deserve.
Teacher Terry
1-25-17, 4:12pm
Last night I was disgusted enough from watching the national news. Then my son called and we were talking and he said Trump is building the wall, we are paying for it and he is cutting the # of refugees in half and of course banning Muslims. Awesome sauce! What a leader!thumbsup!
flowerseverywhere
1-25-17, 5:10pm
Don't we have any laws to stop him??
when he does something illegal we have laws to stop him. I disagree he is crazy. I do not like him or what he is doing, but all along he has said this is what he is going to do. I do not know why anyone is surprised. He is fulfilling his campaign promises as quickly as possible. In any way possible.
Teacher Terry
1-25-17, 5:22pm
I am not surprised but disgusted. Not sure if he is just narcissistic or MI but it does not matter. However, he kept saying Mexico would pay for the wall and now guess what-we are paying for it!
gimmethesimplelife
1-25-17, 5:53pm
I think there is way too much "awfulizing" a Trump presidency, and the many items already posted on social media are small, instubstantial things blown out of proportin.
However, being a friend to the environment is not his priority. So yeah, if decisions come down to environment vs. Something Else, I doubt that the environment will win.Your overall concern is legitimate.IL, I know that you are a conservative and that we have disagreed often. I just wanted to say that I really respect you for seeing this as a conservative. Kudos from the world of Rob! Rob
gimmethesimplelife
1-25-17, 5:56pm
Stop him from what? Approving a pipeline that was already approved at every level of government up to and including the State Department?To stop him from running that pipeline through sacred Indian burial burial grounds...but wait a minute? Money would be lost if basic human dignity were to win out this time with this issue! We can't have that at any cost or consequence, can we? Sarcasm intended Alan, but not towards you, towards Trump and towards America for letting him get away with this. Rob
ApatheticNoMore
1-25-17, 6:10pm
I do not know why anyone is surprised. He is fulfilling his campaign promises as quickly as possible. In any way possible.
but generally those we elect DO NOT fulfill their campaign promises, so that's why people might be surprised. Because they have learned not to believe political promises (which simply means they have been paying attention all these years).
Politicians do not fulfill their campaign promises.
Trump is fulfilling his campaign promises.
Maybe Trump ain't your typical politician
To stop him from running that pipeline through sacred Indian burial burial grounds...but wait a minute?
Thanks for bringing that up Rob, I wasn't aware you were in favor of preventing the government from violating peoples religious liberty and/or traditions. That's good to know.
I'm curious though, would the pipeline actually run through those areas? I was under the impression that the sponsors long ago expressed their intention to route the Keystone pipeline around all known religious sites and allow various tribes the ability to monitor their progress in case they ran across unknown sites.
ApatheticNoMore
1-25-17, 6:31pm
To stop him from running that pipeline through sacred Indian burial burial grounds...but wait a minute? Money would be lost if basic human dignity were to win out this time with this issue! We can't have that at any cost or consequence, can we?
he's not insane, nor were those who drove the Indians off their own land initially leading to mass death. Not insane just .. same as it ever was.
When I asked if there weren't anything we could do to stop him, legally, I was referring to all the lying he's doing. It doesn't make sense that he can manipulate so much without consequences.
He IS a narcissist. They can be brilliant and cunning. But they can't see beyond themselves and have a very skewed view of the world, and they are never wrong, and they lie and they blame everyone else for their problems. Narcissism is the official word.........I was calling it "crazy." Yes, we'll all have to wait and see. But he's been "crazy" from the beginning of his campaign. I know he hasn't changed. He's everything he presented himself as. But I personally wouldn't want to be affiliated with him, or have him as a president. This is a chess game to him. He couldn't give a rip about anyone else but himself. And if the U.S. goes to hell, he'll just fly off to some other country in his jet and live in another one of his hotels.
I'm trying to not get worked up about some of Trumps first offs for executive orders. Some are posturing and some are tokens to appease his supporters and this isn't the hotel business but the burdensome Federal government. The pipeline, the wall, the sanctuary city designations, and whatever else still have other approvals, refining, and legal and funding issues. They may come to be but not without revision and he is starting to be known for reversing his words in mid-course. I'm a little more concerned about what he is doing with the EPA. It looks like he has already sunk his hooks well into their operations, at least so far.
iris lilies
1-26-17, 10:53am
IL, I know that you are a conservative and that we have disagreed often. I just wanted to say that I really respect you for seeing this as a conservative. Kudos from the world of Rob! Rob
Ok, but I am not sure what honest insight I am displaying here, I am just stating the obvious. No one would characterize Trump's campaign as enviromentally friendly.
In my reply to catherine I didnt mean "Trump is awful" which I suspect is your interpretation of my words. I mean that for those whose No. 1 concern is the environment, Trump's actions will likely dissapoint.
Environment is not my #1 concern. I understand that some citizens will be happy with a specific Trump action, others will be indifferent, and still others wont like it.
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