View Full Version : "Neo-Nazis Should Not Have The Right To Rally"
Ultralight
8-16-17, 6:07pm
This is a really good one y'all! It is from HuffPo.
"It is “radical” to suggest that these demonstrators should not have been granted the right to rally in the first place. This is “un-American.” But to truly change the racist fabric of American culture and move the needle towards racial reconciliation and a safe place to live for all Americans, our country needs to truly dismantle the racist employment of the law and enforce legislation that changes our racist culture. This means, white neo-Nazi’s are not granted the right to assemble."
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/uncomfortable-truths-in-the-wake-of-charlottesville_us_5993bccce4b0eef7ad2c0266?sectio n=us_contributor
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt:
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/432/43.html
Been there, done that, got the t-shirt:
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/432/43.html
I remember that march on Skokie, since I lived in Chicago at the time. Here was Mike Royko's take on it:
http://www.idaillinois.org/cdm/ref/collection/skokiepo001/id/41
I remember that march on Skokie, since I lived in Chicago at the time. Here was Mike Royko's take on it:
Yes, people love to use violence.
iris lilies
8-16-17, 8:05pm
You know, UL, we are not your classmates in the school of social work and I would be extremely surprised if someone here agreed with the theoretical idea that neo-Nazis should not have the right of assembly protected by our Constitution.
But it is when practicality comes up that we will get into the weeds of the debate. I heard on NPR, and I assume it's true, that this Nazi group in VA was awarded a permit to hold a rally, but the permit was rescinded when they didn't come in to the area in the way it was agreed they would. Or perhaps they had many followers that didn't know the drill of where they were supposed to enter. So even though they have the theoretical "right" to march, on this particular day, permission was revoked due to practical considerations.
So what's my point? I guess it is that a practical revocation of marching rights, happeneing enough times, is a defacto limit on the right of assembly. If the city of Charlottesville revokes permission enough times, we have a big problem. We have seen right wing rallies denied on the West coast due to safety concerns, and I understand that. If someone gets hurt a bunch of you will moan about how the police didnt protect them. Officers on the street and their leaders will almost always counsel city brass to stop meet ups of large crowds that threaten to get out of hand because these crowds simply are not predictable or controllable, and street cops are ot especially i terested in supporting you while you exercise your co stitutoonal,rights.
I still think the best approach is to let the little skin heads march their little march, wave their tiny flags, shout their silly words. We should stay away so they soon get bored.
oh, and HuffPo's stance is ridiculous, nearly as ridiculous as the Nazis.
You know, UL, we are not your classmates in the school of social work and I would be extremely surprised if someone here agreed with the theoretical idea that neo-Nazis should not have the right of assembly protected by our Constitution.
But it is when practicality comes up that we will get into the weeds of the debate.
Reasonable restrictions on time, place, and manner have been found to be Constitutional. As you say, the devil is in the details there.
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/312/569.html
Remember the fun of the "free speech zones" during the Bush and Obama administrations?
Nothing like showing up to rally inside a cage!
Ultralight
8-16-17, 8:37pm
You know, UL, we are not your classmates in the school of social work and I would be extremely surprised if someone here agreed with the theoretical idea that neo-Nazis should not have the right of assembly protected by our Constitution.
What do you mean here?
You know I am a card-carrying member of the ACLU, right?
Remember the fun of the "free speech zones" during the Bush and Obama administrations?
Nothing like showing up to rally inside a cage!
Yes, I remember that. Totally ridiculous.
iris lilies
8-16-17, 8:53pm
What do you mean here?
You know I am a card-carrying member of the ACLU, right?
I think many of your social work classmates would agree with the Huff Po article.
I don't know anyone on this board who would agree with the
Huff Po article.
I wasnt talking about you, personally. I dont think you will stir up much controversy here because most reasonable adults accept that weve gotta give even skinheads their rights as Americans.
Here is the basic model of HuffPro sociopolitical theory:
A) We must ban the racists.
B) Everybody I dislike is a racist.
Result: Utopia! And all it took were a few "Except for" clauses in the Bill of Rights.
Teacher Terry
8-17-17, 12:52pm
IL: I would really be shocked if UL's classmates would be against free assembly. I don't see that in the students that I teach. The right to assembly is a basic right and without it our freedoms start to implode. OUr university refused to expel or fire from his uni job the student that became infamous for protesting at the rally. Some people think he violated the uni code of conduct but we can't demand that people think/act in the way we want them too. I think a lot of racism was underground but now Trump has made it acceptable to come out of the racist closet.
iris lilies
8-17-17, 12:57pm
IL: I would really be shocked if UL's classmates would be against free assembly. I don't see that in the students that I teach. The right to assembly is a basic right and without it our freedoms start to implode. OUr university refused to expel or fire from his uni job the student that became infamous for protesting at the rally. Some people think he violated the uni code of conduct but we can't demand that people think/act in the way we want them too. I think a lot of racism was underground but now Trump has made it acceptable to come out of the racist closet.
Who is HuffPo's audience, then?
Is HuffPo out there in Alt-left crazy land?
On the other note, it is really a good thing that your university used as an object lesson the protesting student. I assume he was siding with the Nazis or it wouldnt have been much of a lesson.
Teacher Terry
8-17-17, 1:08pm
Yes and it went viral because of the hate on his face, holding a torch and screaming. It was all over social media and people recognized him. It has been all over the national news, etc. His life has been threatened he has said. The uni told him to let them know about the threats so they can investigate but so far he has not so I wonder if they are real. While I certainly hate what he did and our uni is very liberal and in general a supporter of democrats they absolutely did the right thing.
Some light reading for today:
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/il-supreme-court/1864648.html
Yes and it went viral because of the hate on his face, holding a torch and screaming. It was all over social media and people recognized him. It has been all over the national news, etc. His life has been threatened he has said. The uni told him to let them know about the threats so they can investigate but so far he has not so I wonder if they are real. While I certainly hate what he did and our uni is very liberal and in general a supporter of democrats they absolutely did the right thing.
I understand there is a campaign underway whereby people who think they recognize someone from the pictures of the events are posting names, employers, etc. so they can be appropriately excoriated, fired from jobs, etc.
What could possibly go wrong?
What could possibly go wrong?
I think the end-state of that involves free helicopter rides.
Teacher Terry
8-17-17, 4:45pm
People need to think about that before going to one of these events. If you are proud of being a white supremacist then you must be willing to face any of the consequences.
Williamsmith
8-17-17, 4:51pm
People need to think about that before going to one of these events. If you are proud of being a white supremacist then you must be willing to face any of the consequences.
I think the point is....it's not like the reporters are using facial recognition software or employers will be hiring investigative teams to vet mistaken identities. I can see the commercial now....."If you have been falsely accused of attending a KKK or White Supremicist rally and lost your job, you may entitled to back wages, damages and civil judgements. You dont pay a fee unless we get money for you!" Dewey, Cheatem and Howe, Esq.
I understand there is a campaign underway whereby people who think they recognize someone from the pictures of the events are posting names, employers, etc. so they can be appropriately excoriated, fired from jobs, etc.
What could possibly go wrong?
Not that I condone doxxing but they shouldn't be surprised that it's happening to them now since they've been doxxing people on the left for years now.
People need to think about that before going to one of these events. If you are proud of being a white supremacist then you must be willing to face any of the consequences.
Perhaps. But I suspect the people being misidentified by overzealous or myopic Nazi-hunters are less than appreciative of being collateral damage in this particular crusade.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/14/us/charlottesville-doxxing.html?mcubz=1
ApatheticNoMore
8-17-17, 5:00pm
so the main point is we need more worker protections from being fired for non job-related political reasons pretty much. That probably would be a good idea if written narrowly enough.
so the main point is we need more worker protections from being fired for non job-related political reasons pretty much. That probably would be a good idea if written narrowly enough.
I rather enjoy the freedom I have now to not hire Nazis, Commies, sexist pigs, and Flat-Earthers.
I rather enjoy the freedom I have now to not hire Nazis, Commies, sexist pigs, and Flat-Earthers.
I'd hire Caligula if he had a CPA license and a background in municipal finance. I probably wouldn't eat lunch with him, though.
Teacher Terry
8-17-17, 5:14pm
Totally agree Bae.
Totally agree Bae.
That would make for some pretty interesting candidate interviews.
That would make for some pretty interesting candidate interviews.
"Are you now, or have you ever been...." :-)
"Are you now, or have you ever been...." :-)
What is your greatest strength?
My pure Aryan blood.
Where do you see yourself in five years?
In a bunker in Idaho.
Is there anything else you'd like to tell us?
I need to take a personal day on Nathan Bedford Forest's birthday.
Teacher Terry
8-17-17, 5:36pm
:~)
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