View Full Version : Arnold, what were you thinking
flowerseverywhere
5-17-11, 11:31pm
So the news is out that Arnold had a "love child." The terminator became the inseminator.
How could he have kept this secret while the woman remained in his household for ten years?
How could he claim he loves his family while not acknowledging this child?
What is this child going to think when he or she finds out the truth?
When you have everything, a lovely wife and children, more money than you could spend, a legion of admiring fans, how can you allow yourself to do this?
My thoughts exactly. Along with "what an arrogant, selfish, dumb-a$$..."
The Storyteller
5-18-11, 4:50am
I have followed Arnold since he was a 19 year old phenom called the Austrian Oak. This is the guy who on his 30th birthday was profile in a muscle mag as deliberating which three women he was taking to bed that night. That was pre-Maria, but come on... Did anybody really doubt all those women who came forward claiming sexual harassment during his first election?
This is Arnold, people. The only thing that surprises me is that anybody is even surprised, including his wife.
money can buy silence, that's the only explanation for the secret being kept for so long. In spite of all the "I'm sorry" from Arnold do you think he has changed? I don't, this will be just a pause in his pursuit of women for meaningless sex.
I just feel so badly for his wife and children (including the "love child," who hasn't done anything wrong). Something like this would be painful enough, but to have it splashed all over the news, too...how awful.
I have followed Arnold since he was a 19 year old phenom called the Austrian Oak. This is the guy who on his 30th birthday was profile in a muscle mag as deliberating which three women he was taking to bed that night. That was pre-Maria, but come on... Did anybody really doubt all those women who came forward claiming sexual harassment during his first election?
This is Arnold, people. The only thing that surprises me is that anybody is even surprised, including his wife.
What you said! +1
Lately the news seems to be full of famous, married philanderers. Even listening to the local news, way too often there is some married high school teacher accused of being intimate with students. I guess the biological urge is stronger than any common sense or restraint. As dh always says when these things happen, "he was thinking with his little head."
loosechickens
5-18-11, 2:22pm
That's how my sweetie describes it, too, pinkytoe......the "thinking with the little head instead of the big head". I am never able to understand how so MANY otherwise intelligent men who manage to achieve great success, can be so unable to control their sexual behaviors, to the point of bringing their otherwise stellar careers crashing down around them.
It makes one wonder about their abilities to really assess risk. I guess it's true about power corrupting, because when they get so much money and have so much power, they begin to think the rules do not apply to them and they can do as they like.
I guess there are some examples of women in public life doing similar things, but their numbers are few. Maybe we just need more women in positions of power. They seem more able, somehow, to handle it.
I'm afraid that the moniker "Sperminator" is going to stick to the guy like glue......
I feel very badly for the young son, and the rest of his children as well. One can say that wives of powerful men have some idea of the life they are letting themselves in for, but the kids are innocent victims of parental idiocy. Very sad for them.
The Storyteller
5-18-11, 3:50pm
I am never able to understand how so MANY otherwise intelligent men who manage to achieve great success, can be so unable to control their sexual behaviors, to the point of bringing their otherwise stellar careers crashing down around them.
Except that won't happen to Arnold. Women aren't exactly his target audience in film, and to men this will just make him more of the stud. If anything it will make him even more bankable.
I don't think this is your typical stand-up political guy caught cheating. This is a celebrity caught cheating, and the same rules don't apply, as pretty much all of them cheat.
Even the women.
Powerful men using their power to have sex with powerless women (really - household staff?) are misogynists, not philanderers or "boys will be boys".
while this in no way excuses bad choices, it is known that testosterone levels in both men and women increase a lot when they are in a position of power. I think this is partially why we see such a correlation between people of power and affairs.
Powerful men using their power to have sex with powerless women (really - household staff?) are misogynists, not philanderers or "boys will be boys".
I don't condone his actions, but why would you think that she was a victim? Isn't it possible that she was a willing participant?
I see men of no power what so ever cheating on their spouses all the time - as do women who are in powerful position and non-power positions. So I don't think it's a power issue - just ordinary lust that a person (of great moral and character weakness IMHO) chooses to subcumb (sp?) to. As far as Arnolds career movie-wise, I don't think it'll impact it one way or another. I'm a HUGE fan of most of his sci-fi and war-type stuff and will continue to see his movies. His character flaws don't effect how I view him as an actor - although they would as a right-wing family-first politician.
I don't condone his actions, but why would you think that she was a victim? Isn't it possible that she was a willing participant?
I read she was married and passed the child off as her husbands. In my eye's she cheated just as much as he did.
When I read the news it really sort of made me sick to my stomach. What embarrassment he has brought upon his family and himself. I don't think any of us are immune from temptation - hense we should not test the temptation - if that makes any sense. Especially if he was known to have these issues. Trust is so hard to regain once it is lost.
There are no illegitimate children only illegitimate adults!
I don't condone his actions, but why would you think that she was a victim? Isn't it possible that she was a willing participant?
Because of the power imbalance. And since he was her employer, it sure could be on the job sexual harassment. It's possible that the Lord of the Manor and the hired domestic help were on equal social footing, that the woman didn't really need her job, and she was fully prepared to have a covert affair with someone who had married into one of the most powerful families in America and is a known "womanizer ', by which I read exploits vulnerable women, so they had a fully consensual torrid affair of love and/or lust. But I doubt it.
ApatheticNoMore
5-19-11, 2:33am
It's certainly possible she wanted to cheat with him, there's a power imbalance, but no coercion is actually necessary to get someone to jump in your bed if you are a powerful, famous, rich, and attractive (to some) man. The very power you hold is itself attractive to some.
I don't really believe monogamy comes naturally to people over the long run anyway. And yes I think having power has something to do with the actual tendency to cheat. So it's unfortunate, and sadly predictable.
His character flaws don't effect how I view him as an actor - although they would as a right-wing family-first politician.
Yea but really Arnold NEVER ran on that kind of platform, on social conservatism. He ran socially liberal.
The Storyteller
5-19-11, 10:26am
Arnold has always been incredibly charismatic. That is what made him what he is. He became a highly successful actor and couldn't act, and he became the governor of the most populace state in the country with absolutely zero political experience, all because of his charisma. His power stems from that charisma, not the other way around. It is not difficult for me to see why women might be attracted to him.
I don't think it is necessary to read anything into it beyond that.
Just another rich republican thinking rules and commitments don't apply to him.
Could it also be possible that the woman planned this whole scenario? After all, she is receiving child support and has retired at 50 with a nice, paid for house.
Just another rich republican thinking rules and commitments don't apply to him.
You're probably right. A rich democrat would never do that! cough, cough john edwards (http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/john-edwards-admits-fathered-rielle-hunter-child-affair/story?id=9620812).
The only thing that could make the situation worse is if his wife was dying during the affair. Cough Cough John Edwards.
ApatheticNoMore
5-19-11, 12:32pm
You're probably right. A rich democrat would never do that! cough, cough john edwards (http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/john-edwards-admits-fathered-rielle-hunter-child-affair/story?id=9620812).
Never mind the most famous one of all, yea I know what happened with that intern wasn't REALLY sex right? ;)
Oh and a Kennedy like Maria actually grows up in a family where such things are done by the men of the house (perhaps sadly kinda programs the women to tolerate it I guess).
It wouldn't surprise me if the current president cheats, he's young enough still, he's handsome, and yes he's got all that immense power. There's nothing wrong with his wife, but then Kennedy cheated on Jackie afterall!
never mind the most famous one of all, yea I know what happened with that intern wasn't REALLY sex right? ;)
That depends on what your definition of 'is' is.
Does anyone know why after 10+ years, this all came out now??
Yea but really Arnold NEVER ran on that kind of platform, on social conservatism. He ran socially liberal.
True, but he still made/influenced public policy and law - much of which dealt with social issues, morality, ethics, etc... So to me his character does matter as an elected politician. Where as, as an actor (a job that doesn't effect me), I don't care anymore about his character than I do about the guy who rotates my tires. OK so I rotate my own tires but you know what I mean :-)!
The only thing that could make the situation worse is if his wife was dying during the affair. Cough Cough John Edwards.
Gary Hart, democratic senator..cough...cough....
Could it also be possible that the woman planned this whole scenario? After all, she is receiving child support and has retired at 50 with a nice, paid for house.
I wouldn't think so. But, considering she had an approx. 8 year old son chalk full of Swartzeneggager DNA about the time he was first elected, I would say she had his weinerschnizel in a vise grip! Can you imagine the havoc to his political career she could have caused had she come forward with this during the time he was being accused of groping women, etc..? The money she could have made from the tabloids for telling her story? Poor wittle Arne was probably pooping in his Lederhosen at that time :-)!
Thanks Spartana. I laughed when I read your reply. For whatever reason, I am nonplussed by this story. I suppose it has all happened before. The person I really felt sympathy for was Mrs. Elliot Spitzer. That scandal rocked me to my socks. I just remember her face at the press conference. I suppose you carry on, but sometimes somethings happen in your life you just cannot get over. Maria and Arnie at least made a dignified exit. Maria will do just fine with or without any guy actually. The other person I feel concern for is the kids, other family members and friends. Arnie will do just fine. It's the people we don't see who are directly involved in the story that I wonder about. How will Arnie and Maria's kids cope with the public embarrassment?
Gary Hart, democratic senator..cough...cough....
There's no business like Monkey Business.
Here, have a cough drop....better now?
The big difference here guys, and you know I could cough up a dozen ne'er-do-well republicans, is that the democrats aren't trying to RUN on this family values crap. They aren't up there wagging their fingers at the rest of us in phony sanctimonious piety while they diddle the secretary on the side. Newt's wife was in the hospital with cancer while he was cheating on her, and trying to hang Clinton for getting a BJ. What a lying hypocrite! What John Edwards did was totally scumbag. Everyone pretty much agrees on that. But don't pretend there aren't as many, or more, bad acting republicans. Just because we aren't 'coughing' them up doesn't mean they aren't out there.
Here, have a cough drop....better now?
The big difference here guys, and you know I could cough up a dozen ne'er-do-well republicans, is that the democrats aren't trying to RUN on this family values crap. They aren't up there wagging their fingers at the rest of us in phony sanctimonious piety while they diddle the secretary on the side. Newt's wife was in the hospital with cancer while he was cheating on her, and trying to hang Clinton for getting a BJ. What a lying hypocrite! What John Edwards did was totally scumbag. Everyone pretty much agrees on that. But don't pretend there aren't as many, or more, bad acting republicans. Just because we aren't 'coughing' them up doesn't mean they aren't out there.
Peggy, you probably misunderstood the intent of the last few posts. It seems that some folks just can't help seeing everything through partisan eyes. When they do, it's kinda fun to pop the bubble. I know you'd do the same for me wouldn't you?
That's why I enjoy some of you guys so much.:~)
http://media.townhall.com/townhall/car/b/shelton_c20070904.jpg (http://townhall.com/political-cartoons/mikeshelton)
Here, have a cough drop....better now?
The big difference here guys, and you know I could cough up a dozen ne'er-do-well republicans, is that the democrats aren't trying to RUN on this family values crap. They aren't up there wagging their fingers at the rest of us in phony sanctimonious piety while they diddle the secretary on the side. Newt's wife was in the hospital with cancer while he was cheating on her, and trying to hang Clinton for getting a BJ. What a lying hypocrite! What John Edwards did was totally scumbag. Everyone pretty much agrees on that. But don't pretend there aren't as many, or more, bad acting republicans. Just because we aren't 'coughing' them up doesn't mean they aren't out there.
I'm not defending the others (republican or democrat), just pointing out it's not just Arnold cheating on his wife. With regard to Clinton, the problem wasn't so much the act it was the lying about the act. Edwards may have used campaign money for his concubine.
With regard to "family values crap," I would think all politicians should respect the family unit. Didn't realize that was such a partisan item.
The fake moral outrage over the sex lives of politicians is kind of silly to me. When a group sets the bar high in terms of moral values and uses that to be a cornerstone of their political agenda then as far as I'm concerned they have crossed the line in terms of representing people.
The politicization of "moral values" is nothing more than but a front for more government meddling in our private lives. Drugs, assisted suicide, marriage, abortion, porn, smoking, obesity, are just a few of the things that the "moral elite" demand from government.
Politicians are not concerned in the least with "moral values," except as when they can be used as slogans around which to energize the masses against their neighbors.
In politics it is always important to remember that there is only one goal - power - getting it, keeping it, and expanding it.
In other words - who someone is "doing" is none of my business.
Peace
ApatheticNoMore
5-19-11, 5:47pm
The big difference here guys, and you know I could cough up a dozen ne'er-do-well republicans, is that the democrats aren't trying to RUN on this family values crap.
But again neither did Arnold. For heavens sake the guy is pro gay marriage and pro-choice. Pretty liberal overall but has a few moderately *fiscal* (not social) conservative inclinations.
Family values are really none of the politician's business but Arnold isn't a person who made them his business. I mean um ok maybe if there are things that are actively harming families it *might* *maybe* call for some intervention. But in general it's none of their business.
Personally I wish "family values" were as separate from politics are church and state are supposed to be. I really don't give a rats pitutty anymore who any of our politicians care to sleep with. Give me the guys & gals who can run the show, right the ship. The people who have the kahunas to make some tough decisions. They can do any damn thing they please after 5:00. I simply don't have any room in my life to care about who the governator boffed. I'm frankly kind of surprised anyone else does.
Personally I wish "family values" were as separate from politics are church and state are supposed to be. I really don't give a rats pitutty anymore who any of our politicians care to sleep with. Give me the guys & gals who can run the show, right the ship. The people who have the kahunas to make some tough decisions. They can do any damn thing they please after 5:00. I simply don't have any room in my life to care about who the governator boffed. I'm frankly kind of surprised anyone else does.
Amen! Amen! Amen!
poetry_writer
5-20-11, 9:03am
The "other woman" involved is not exactly innocent either. She knew that he was a married man! I feel very sorry for the children involved in all this.
But again neither did Arnold. For heavens sake the guy is pro gay marriage and pro-choice. Pretty liberal overall but has a few moderately *fiscal* (not social) conservative inclinations.
Family values are really none of the politician's business but Arnold isn't a person who made them his business. I mean um ok maybe if there are things that are actively harming families it *might* *maybe* call for some intervention. But in general it's none of their business.
Oh I absolutely agree. Just as with Clinton, I could care less who 'does' who. Like Gregg said, just give us someone who can do the job.
I know yall were just poking fun Alan. I guess what gets my goat is the hypocritical aspect of it, (not necessarily in Arnolds case) but like with Gingrich, and other right wing politicians. Family values, real family values, isn't something you wrap a sledge hammer in to beat your opponent with. And the right is famous for that, yet seem to look the other way when it's one of their own 'doing the deed'. That's what I meant by family values crap. If someone makes 'family values' and moral bearing as their platform, then I think it's fair game to call them on it when they do bad. They can't have it both ways. They can't wag their finger and pass judgement on me while marrying and cheating on 3 women (that we know of)-Gingrich. They can't state something then call it 'gotcha' if the media quotes them verbatim- Gingrich again, and Palin. These people have to know we're watching! And we remember! And if we don't, there's video! Always!
If they put themselves out there, and try to pass themselves off as one thing, well I'm going to call them on it if they are not. Nothing gotcha about that.
I think Arnold pretty much revealed himself from the start and as someone said earlier, I'm surprised anyone is surprised. this doesn't change my opinion of him one way or another. Actually, I don't think he's a bad politician. I think, like so many other politicians, he was handed a difficult and tangled job and hasn't done a terrible job overall. Government doesn't start and stop with each elected official and each has only what he/she was left to work with.
The Storyteller
5-20-11, 10:49am
Personally I wish "family values" were as separate from politics are church and state are supposed to be.
Key words, there.
The day we elect an atheist Buddhist or Muslim or Jew as president then I will begin to believe it.
Begin.
I would take as a victory just seeing anything other than a Christian having even a decent shot.
The Storyteller
5-20-11, 10:55am
The only time anything like this counts in my mind is when the politician in question preaches strongly one thing, yet behaves another. Arnold didn't do that. He has never held himself up as a paragon of virtue.
BTW, I'm absolutely disgusted with the media's decision to out this poor woman and even talking about the poor kid who is involved. Every time I am convinced they have sunk about as low as they can go, they pull something to push that envelope just a little more.
There's no business like Monkey Business.
Gary (cough, cough) Condit democratic congressman.
But again neither did Arnold. For heavens sake the guy is pro gay marriage and pro-choice. Pretty liberal overall but has a few moderately *fiscal* (not social) conservative inclinations.
Family values are really none of the politician's business but Arnold isn't a person who made them his business. I mean um ok maybe if there are things that are actively harming families it *might* *maybe* call for some intervention. But in general it's none of their business.
It's not the fact that he is socially liberal (as am I as well as a democrate) and may not take a stand on family values per se. It is the fact that he is a lier and a cheater and a man unable to control his libedo for the woman and family he has made a commitment to. Character flaws many people on either side of the polictical spectrum don't want in their politicians and leaders (yes, I know, that is sort of naive). So, at least to me, it doesn't matter if he is pro-gay marriage (as I am) or supports any libreal agenda, I find fault with him as a leader.
The only time anything like this counts in my mind is when the politician in question preaches strongly one thing, yet behaves another. Arnold didn't do that. He has never held himself up as a paragon of virtue.
BTW, I'm absolutely disgusted with the media's decision to out this poor woman and even talking about the poor kid who is involved. Every time I am convinced they have sunk about as low as they can go, they pull something to push that envelope just a little more.
A person doesn't have to preach anything or even take a stand on anything or even hold themselfs up as a paragon of virtue. If you've made a vow of marriage and choose to violate that vow then I would say that speaks high for the persons character (or lack there of)..
And again, I don't personally care what a person does or how they behave or where their values are if I have no interaction with those things, but an elected leader and his behavior has the potential to effect me.
The day we elect an atheist Buddhist or Muslim or Jew as president then I will begin to believe it.
There are those who think we did! :devil:
Seriously, the vast majority of people in this country who are associated with any religion name Christianity as their faith of choice. If the most citizens align with it then it naturally follows that most of our elected officials would as well. That's part of why it's called representation. If the country ever gets to the point were atheists, Buddhists, Muslims or Jews make up a majority I have no doubt they will be well represented.
The thing that bothers me the most was the on-going nature of the betrayal--10 years of lying by both the housekeeper and the sperminator. Maria must feel terribly betrayed by people she trusted most.
The thing that bothers me the most was the on-going nature of the betrayal--10 years of lying by both the housekeeper and the sperminator. Maria must feel terribly betrayed by people she trusted most.
Is Arnold any different than "joe citizen" in terms of significance? Are our role models movie stars? Politicians? Oops, I guess I answered my own question.:laff:
In my life's journey I have seen many a good man and women having to deal with infidelity - I don't think it is about money or class - it is about human nature. In a good relationship these issues seldom arise....although I will admit that in my youth I did have a few instances of flirting and trying to get into a few friends pants - thankfully "our" friends were able to resist the temptation. In my case I was always easy and thankfully it never screwed up my marriage. We both accept our youthful transgressions and never would dare bring it up between us.
At 60 these things seem to be less important - been there done that - the female body and mind are a males ying/yang no matter the age.
FYI - 34th anniversary this weekend - end of the world.....who cares, I'll die in my baby's arms!!
Peace
Is Arnold any different than "joe citizen" in terms of significance? Are our role models movie stars? Politicians? Oops, I guess I answered my own question.:laff:
In my life's journey I have seen many a good man and women having to deal with infidelity - I don't think it is about money or class - it is about human nature. In a good relationship these issues seldom arise....although I will admit that in my youth I did have a few instances of flirting and trying to get into a few friends pants - thankfully "our" friends were able to resist the temptation. In my case I was always easy and thankfully it never screwed up my marriage. We both accept our youthful transgressions and never would dare bring it up between us.
At 60 these things seem to be less important - been there done that - the female body and mind are a males ying/yang no matter the age.
FYI - 34th anniversary this weekend - end of the world.....who cares, I'll die in my baby's arms!!
Peace
I don't think it's the infidelity that bothers people so much, but it's his lack of integrity. He has been dishonorable, dishonest, untrustworthy, and shown a great lack of both moral fortitude and ethical backbone towards the very people he purports to love and cherish above all others. - his spouse and children. Once that moral line has been crossed in a person's private life, I think it's much easier to cross that line again in public life or work life (once a criminal always a crimiminal??) and subcumb to the many temptations a high ranking politician faces every day. Will he be more easily corrupted by power, money, and other temptations than a person who withstood temptations in their private life? People who had that moral fortitude and backbone to ignore those temptations - be they for money, power, greed, sex, or fame? I don't think so. So, as a Californian, I don't want someone who may be much more likely to cross that unethical line (and maybe illegal lines too) representing me as a political leader - especially one which wields great power over the public (and their tax dollars) and who may be easily corruptable. I believe that a person who holds themselves to a high standard in their personal life, will continue to hold to that high standard in their professional life. And visa-versa. My previous job was in a VERY corruption filled arena (environmental compliance officer who dealt with industrial waste dischargers - i.e. big industry) and I know for a fact that those who retained their ethical standards in their private lives were MUCH less likely to be taking brides or kick backs or looking the other way on the job.
Just my two cents (and worth every penny >8))!! And a big HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to you ZigZag Man.:cool:!thumbsup!
"
So long as religious and political leaders continue to ignore our evolutionary heritage, and thus do not put in place structures of internal and external support that can withstand the high dosages of testosterone that high status and power necessarily confer, then there will be no hope for a less calamitous future.
Understanding the unwanted drives within us as having served our ancestors for millions of years is far more empowering than imagining that we are the way we are because of inner demons, or because the world’s first woman and man ate a forbidden apple a few thousand years ago. The path to freedom lies in appreciating one’s instincts, while taking steps to channel these powerful energies in ways that will serve our higher purposes (Dowd, 2007, 148)."
source: http://www.metanexus.net/magazine/tabid/68/id/10333/Default.aspx
Mangano's Gold
5-24-11, 1:05am
I wonder how often a man has intimate relations with the women who work in his house, excluding his wife?
ApatheticNoMore
5-24-11, 2:04pm
Yea, I wonder how realistic it even is to expect people to be faithful. Mind you if he were my husband, his head would be ON A PLATTER!!!
Mangano's Gold
5-24-11, 2:30pm
Yea, I wonder how realistic it even is to expect people to be faithful. Mind you if he were my husband, his head would be ON A PLATTER!!!
Temptation is, well, well, tempting. The less temptation the less infidelity. Few things are this certain.
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