View Full Version : The 5% tariff against Mexico.....
gimmethesimplelife
6-5-19, 9:53am
I have held off on posting about this as I've been very upset and did not want to post until I calmed down at least somewhat. I do want to start off with one positive development that bring me a bit of hope and some surprise - much of the GOP seems to be against this series of escalating tariffs. Good to see that, and I say this with appreciation and no snark.
Now that I have calmed down somewhat I can logically ask - ? HUH? I don't get it, I really don't get how raising the prices on a wide array of consumer products without accompanying raises is going to help this country - nor will the job loss on BOTH sides of the border if these tariffs are implemented. I just don't get it but I am glad to see the Thug Of Orange And Despair being turned on by his own party. Rob
Teacher Terry
6-5-19, 11:38am
It won’t help but will only hurt.
gimmethesimplelife
6-5-19, 12:45pm
It’s just foolishThank You for agreeing with me, bae. Rob
gimmethesimplelife
6-5-19, 12:45pm
It won’t help but will only hurt.Bingo! You nailed it, TT. Rob
Teacher Terry
6-5-19, 2:10pm
Plus the average family is struggling as it is with the cost of living. Politicians are so out of touch.
All this brouhaha is yet another instance of the Republican strategy of government by shiny object. These tariffs will not go forward, or if they do it will be in some greatly attenuated form.
In the meantime, the media harps on this day and night (when they aren't fixated on Trump making an ass of himself abroad). More news cycles dominated by a non-story, while Trump and his cronies continue to line their pockets and drive their reactionary political agendas.
The current administration is a smash-and-grab operation, and the Republican party isn't a political party, it's a criminal conspiracy.
Teacher Terry
6-5-19, 6:22pm
I totally agree oldhat.
My brother told me immigration is fueled by poverty and desperation "so let''s put in tariffs to destroy the Mexican economy and increase people's poverty and desperation, because that will solve the border crisis. Brilliant plan Trump!"
gimmethesimplelife
6-6-19, 9:18am
Talks continue today between the negotiating team sent up from Mexico by Lopez Obrador and Trump's administration. I am hoping but not counting on some kind of compromise that stops the tariffs from starting but it seems more and more to me that Trump wants the tariffs to take place and this negotiating on that part of the Trump administration is solely for the sake of appearance.
Not much I can do about this even as an activist, I get that, but I did send the Mexican Embassy in Washington DC an email as an US citizen apologizing for the United States and for the horrendous and hostile attitude of it's President. I further went on to thank Mexico for always being there for myself and many other Americans and I stated that I stood with Mexico regardless of my US citizenship and passport. This time the United States is going too damned far, yet once again........
Potential winner from all this needless drama? Lopez Obrador, the leftist President of Mexico. He is handling himself with such dignity and class and poise - completely unlike Donald Trump, and I believe the world is noticing. My family in Austria tells me they are proud of me for having my dental work done in Mexico - but this was not a political move on my part but entirely voting with my feet for sheer the economics of the situation, but they can think what they want. They believe I should offshore more going forward - nice idea in theory, but if Mexico is pushed far enough, what's to stop them from making it difficult for US nationals to enter their country? Something I so impressed with.....the diplomatic team that Lopez Obrador has sent up to DC? Without coming right out and saying it, apparently subtle hints have been dropped that if Mexico is pushed too far, China is there to at least partially fill the role for them that the US does. ABSOLUTELY BRILLIANT on the part of Mexico.....but not so great for the US.
I'm just amazed at the level of adulting I see emanating from the Mexican delegation vs. the behavior I see from the Trump Administration. Though on the one hand, I am grateful to have a full stomach and a roof overhead (and some money put away in the credit union!!!), I am very embarrassed regarding how the Trump Administration is bullying Mexico. This isn't going to end well for America if tariffs indeed are implemented against Mexico. Rob
PS I'm displaying the Mexican flag again in my yard - a show of support for the negotiating team Obrador has sent up from Mexico City. It's the least I can do after Mexico has been there for me when America has not. Find this radical? A). Be VERY grateful your economic situation allows you to find this radical as many US citizens no longer share this luxury with you, and B). I'm far from the only US national who thinks this way/has reached these conclusions, a fact that has spread far beyond my infamous zip code. Rob
Teacher Terry
6-6-19, 11:28am
If trump is stupid enough to impose tariffs and it hurts our economy he will lose the election. Families are struggling as is without any more economic hardship.
I think protectionist policies are foolish, whether coming from the left or the right. In the long run, neo-mercantilist economies pay a price for it.
gimmethesimplelife
6-6-19, 11:57am
If trump is stupid enough to impose tariffs and it hurts our economy he will lose the election. Families are struggling as is without any more economic hardship.Interestingly enough, due to the effects of the proposed tariffs against the auto industry, some of Trump's base would be among the most severely impacted by needless economic hardship. I live in one of the top three states predicted to suffer the most due to these proposed tariffs of despair - but what fertile grounds to make Arizona a blue state next time around!!! Rob
If trump is stupid enough to impose tariffs and it hurts our economy he will lose the election. Families are struggling as is without any more economic hardship.
I imagine there will always be certain places or people who will struggle and are victims of things out of their control, but at least in my zip code there seems to be a lot of money right now. National unemployment is at historic lows, wages are improving, and those investing in stocks or real estate have probably done well. It's a mystery to me how T could do as many dumb sounding things and still have the economy turn our so well, but the numbers say most people are doing relatively well. It is probably how he can get away with something as audacious as the recent tariffs. I think he could be bluffing.
As per the Wash Post today, sounds like there are wheels in motion to avoid Mx tariffs. 6000 MX Natl Guard troops to their southern border to stem the tide. We'll see...as Trump is usually mostly bluster.
If trump is stupid enough to impose tariffs and it hurts our economy he will lose the election. Families are struggling as is without any more economic hardship.
I wish I could believe you. The R people will vote for him come hell or high water because they are born and bred to be Rs. Makes me sick>:( And many of them are well-educated and smart people!
gimmethesimplelife
6-6-19, 7:12pm
Too cool! I just received an email from one of the Human Rights Organizations that I support informing of a huge/protest rally coming up in Tijuana this weekend - a border unity rally per Lopez Obrador's words. Apparently Lopez Obrador will be appearing there himself as part of the rally/protest. Rob
Teacher Terry
6-6-19, 7:35pm
G, I hope I am right but I have read many times that the economy is the most important thing to most people.
If people were paying attention Julian Castro would be higher in the polls. He has a Marshall Plan for Latin America to address the root causes of the border crisis.
ApatheticNoMore
6-7-19, 12:37am
If people were paying attention Julian Castro would be higher in the polls. He has a Marshall Plan for Latin America to address the root causes of the border crisis.
that seems that may be the single most improbable proposal of any candidate running. Sure some have ambitious policy, but they focus on theoretically doable things in the U.S., and at least they are theoretically accountable to us via our vote ( all of latin america doesn't get a vote in the u.s. election).
Half the countries in latin america might want the u.s. out period, because many have experienced some form of u.s. interference before. True if you start waving money around there is no saying what government you can't buy to do your bidding, but that will just tend to look like quid pro quo. If we want money to go to this (although I very much doubt it's a voter priority) maybe they could filter it through a more neutral party like the U.N.. The U.S. hand's are just too dirty.
Well it worked with Germany and Japan and they were our sworn enemies. It's better than spending money blowing up the Middle East.
Well it worked with Germany and Japan and they were our sworn enemies. It's better than spending money blowing up the Middle East.
That was after we had defeated them in war. Is Mr Castro suggesting we should take over Central and South America so that we can re-build them?
That was after we had defeated them in war. Is Mr Castro suggesting we should take over Central and South America so that we can re-build them?
We’ve already tried that countless times, but perhaps without enough conviction to make it work. Perhaps we need to drop an H bomb on the civilians in Caracas to really get the ball rolling. That supposedly did the trick in Japan.
gimmethesimplelife
6-7-19, 11:09pm
Good news. I just read on yahoo.com news that the tariffs against Mexico to be started on Monday have been dropped for the time being. There is still to be a big rally in Tijuana featuring an appearance by Lopez Obrador. Color me glad that the tariffs have been iced. Phew! Rob
That was after we had defeated them in war. Is Mr Castro suggesting we should take over Central and South America so that we can re-build them?
The Mouse That Roared is a satirical book, later a film, about a small country attacking the US so it can get help from it rebuilding. Interesting premise.
Castro is not suggesting war, but war has wracked Guatemala, Honduras and El Salvador, civil wars previously including ones we were involved in covertly, gang and drug wars now, the drug wars driven by our demand.They do need help. If I lived there I would probably take my family and flee. Ending the wars and bringing stability and aid is what will make people stay.
Good news. I just read on yahoo.com news that the tariffs against Mexico to be started on Monday have been dropped for the time being. There is still to be a big rally in Tijuana featuring an appearance by Lopez Obrador. Color me glad that the tariffs have been iced. Phew! Rob
On to the next shiny object...
gimmethesimplelife
6-8-19, 9:22am
On to the next shiny object...No, not really. It's just that Mexico has been there for me when America has not been and I'm not one to forget such. The tariffs - though postponed and hopefully off the table for good - amount to nothing to me but brutal bullying with severe negative consequences on BOTH sides of the border. In the 85006, we would have been looking at much higher food prices in a struggling though gentrifying area with no raises to make up for these price increases. This is not a shiny object to me but is economic survival - YMMV but where I live what I just posted is a universal truth. Rob
Maybe oldhat is referring to the never-ending parade of provocative proposals Trump trots out to distract from the Mueller Report. I suppose some pointless, destructive war is next up.
iris lilies
6-8-19, 10:47am
Maybe oldhat is referring to the never-ending parade of provocative proposals Trump trots out to distract from the Mueller Report. I suppose some pointless, destructive war is next up.
Actually, President Trump is pretty resistant to getting involved in foreign conflicts, seen when we look beyond headline news. Blustering and threats and etc. are just part of his game.
But speaking to the important point, the price of avocados in a tariff laden world, it was remarkable how my fellow yuppies were stymied by the thought of their easily-affordable food going up in price. Giving up guacamole would have been a sacrifice.
gimmethesimplelife
6-8-19, 11:21am
Maybe oldhat is referring to the never-ending parade of provocative proposals Trump trots out to distract from the Mueller Report. I suppose some pointless, destructive war is next up.Oh OK. Once again I quote the late Gilda Radner in her role on SNL as Rosanne Roseanna Danna "Never mind" - it's not all about me, I get that. Sorry that I seem to have misunderstood Oldhat. Rob
gimmethesimplelife
6-8-19, 11:25am
Actually, President Trump is pretty resistant to getting involved in foreign conflicts, seen when we look beyond headline news. Blustering and threats and etc. are just part of his game.
But speaking to the important point, the price of avocados in a tariff laden world, it was remarkable how my fellow yuppies were stymied by the thought of their easily-affordable food going up in price. Giving up guacamole would have been a sacrifice.Giving up guacamole? No big deal. What's really scary is the potential of Mexico making access to affordable health care difficult or impossible to access for US citizens, thereby causing US citizens deaths that are entirely the fault of the United States. That is what is hard to deal with/accept/rationalize away. Guacamole and Tecate and tequila and flat screen TVs and even more expensive cars don't hold a candle to US citizen deaths should access to affordable health care in Mexico be denied or made difficult for lower income people (say via expensive visas to enter Mexico). This is the real issue - other things being more expensive pales in comparison to this. Though I will say making Mexican produce more expensive could start internal rebellion in the many with little or nothing to lose to begin with. Rob
Teacher Terry
6-8-19, 11:33am
Rob, Mexico makes money off us and I really doubt that they would hurt themselves by limiting access for Americans. The president of Mexico is smarter than our orange moron.
gimmethesimplelife
6-8-19, 11:39am
Rob, Mexico makes money off us and I really doubt that they would hurt themselves by limiting access for Americans. The president of Mexico is smarter than our orange moron.I hope you are right, TT. It does seem as if Mexico has been targeted for abuse by this Administration - though I will also say that America does have some legit grievances against Mexico, too. This street works two ways - especially if you are middle class or above. For those under that level, this is much more a one way street with America more fully to blame. (a reference mostly to US health care access).
I also agree with you about Mexico's president. I find myself very much impressed with the dignity and poise and class of Lopez Obrador and how he handled himself in this tough situation. Not a total cave and minus the bluff and bluster of The Orange Thug With No Clue Of The Consequences Of His Actions. After a series of not especially great Mexican Presidents, I'm glad Lopez Obrador was elected.....and he's very much risen in approval polls in Mexico, too - his measured and dignified approach towards this crisi seems to have earned him respect across a broad swatch of Mexican society. Rob
iris lilies
6-8-19, 12:07pm
Giving up guacamole? No big deal. What's really scary is the potential of Mexico making access to affordable health care difficult or impossible to access for US citizens, thereby causing US citizens deaths that are entirely the fault of the United States. That is what is hard to deal with/accept/rationalize away. Guacamole and Tecate and tequila and flat screen TVs and even more expensive cars don't hold a candle to US citizen deaths should access to affordable health care in Mexico be denied or made difficult for lower income people (say via expensive visas to enter Mexico). This is the real issue - other things being more expensive pales in comparison to this. Though I will say making Mexican produce more expensive could start internal rebellion in the many with little or nothing to lose to begin with. Rob
Ah, glad you got an opportunity to post on your hobby horse. It must never get old for you.Glad I could be of service, keeping this thread going. I live to serve my fellow online community members.
Ultralight
6-8-19, 12:19pm
Ah, glad you got an opportunity to post on your hobby horse. It must never get old for you.Glad I could be of service, keeping this thread going. I live to serve my fellow online community members.
Mexico good. Cops bad.
gimmethesimplelife
6-8-19, 4:11pm
Mexico good. Cops bad.If only life were so simple. Rob
If only life were so simple. Rob
Judging by the hundreds of posts you've made on the two subjects mentioned, it apparently is.
Perhaps other states are different, but: In MA, if you are less than 300% of the poverty level, in the neighborhood of 48K of income. the monthly price for health insurance is less than $150. To me, that is affordable, I don't feel the need to fly down to Mexico for my health care. I think the usa is doing pretty well by me. I paid lots of taxes for many years, so now that I'm not working , I appreciate this reduced cost for health insurance. But it ism't free, so I suppose I'm supposed to be out protesting somewhere and dissing my country for not providing it for free?
gimmethesimplelife
6-8-19, 4:34pm
Judging by the hundreds of posts you've made on the two subjects mentioned, it apparently is.Explanation: Mexico is no angel - it has numerous issues and many part of it are no longer especially safe. It is not Mexico's fault however, that it functions as a safety valve for so many Americans - this fault belongs to those at the top in America who see to it that the lions share of the wealth in this country funnels up to them, thereby forcing many to cross the border to access that which they are not worth in America. How to forgive America for this once you understand this and can see it for what it is? \
I have no idea to be honest.
About cops - there are scattered good ones, many mediocre ones, and some that just should never have been hired in the first place. The press about the police these days is mostly bad.....case in point, felony charges were recently dished out to an officer in DeKalb County, Georgia, right outside the Atlanta city limits, for brutally attacking a shoplifting suspect with a baton. Thankfully a customer in the store filmed it on smartphone video, and downloaded the video to social media, which prompted the felony charges as a save face measure (but who cares, the officer did commit a crime, what' s important is that he pays for it fully through the criminal justice system). This type of video is captured every day of police officers all around this country, Alan. Whether you can accept it or not, this is true and real and won't go away if you choose to deny this reality.
Once again, the public has had it's full and is standing up to such evil these days. Luckily, with the Noor conviction and scattered others around the US recently, this will become more common in the future - police officers facing charges for brutal beatings/murders.
Do all police officers engage in such behavior? NO - there I admitted it, NO. But enough do so that there is a daily supply of such video originating from a new confrontation(s) every day in America. That is inexcusable and is FINALLY being addressed. Way overdue, true, but better late than never. And whoever invented social media, I hope they became very well off due to the power social media gives to innocent civilians when police (frequently) break the law.
But no, this is not simple. What is lacking with both of us is that neither of us proposes anything to solve the root problem - why are LEO behaving in such ways to being with, and what can be done to address this issue? Neither of the two of us has addressed this.....all I have addressed is the fallout and civilian cash-in/civilian protections methods against the police, and you seem to have addressed denial that such is even happening to begin with, even in the face of mountains of evidence to the contrary.
But no, life is not that simple. Were it only........Rob
Video's taken during confrontations rarely capture events and actions leading up to the confrontation you see. You should consider that in your evaluations and condemnations, otherwise you're just stirring a pot that perhaps would best be left to simmer.
gimmethesimplelife
6-8-19, 4:54pm
Perhaps other states are different, but: In MA, if you are less than 300% of the poverty level, in the neighborhood of 48K of income. the monthly price for health insurance is less than $150. To me, that is affordable, I don't feel the need to fly down to Mexico for my health care. I think the usa is doing pretty well by me. I paid lots of taxes for many years, so now that I'm not working , I appreciate this reduced cost for health insurance. But it ism't free, so I suppose I'm supposed to be out protesting somewhere and dissing my country for not providing it for free?Do you see a glaring weakness in your post? I don't say this to be a jerk or combative, it's just that it's very obvious to me. Point being: We don't all live in Massachusetts with the deal that you describe. How'd you like to live on Texas on a low wage and no expanded Medicaid and become sick, of course in Texas minimum wage being $7,25 an hour. What other realistic options would you have in this situation other than Mexico? Rob
So, a deal was already in place long before trump started making the fake tariff threats. What a pathetic loser of a president. Hopefully 1 1/2 years from now we won’t have a child drama queen leading our country.
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEJfHuaIZ0rbnLOD_zsG7nIoqGQgEKhAIACoHCAowocv1Cj CSptoCMPrTpgU?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen
Hopefully 1 1/2 years from now we won’t have a child drama queen leading our country.
Oh I hope and pray you are correct!!!!!!!
gimmethesimplelife
6-9-19, 9:14am
Oh I hope and pray you are correct!!!!!!!Add my name and prayers that jp1 is correct, also........Trump is just a buffoon. Rob
gimmethesimplelife
6-9-19, 9:29am
So, a deal was already in place long before trump started making the fake tariff threats. What a pathetic loser of a president. Hopefully 1 1/2 years from now we won’t have a child drama queen leading our country.
https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEJfHuaIZ0rbnLOD_zsG7nIoqGQgEKhAIACoHCAowocv1Cj CSptoCMPrTpgU?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3AenI didn't think it was possible, but it apparently is. I now think even less of Trump after reading what you have posted, jp1. And I still can't shake this horrible feeling that he will be reelected, having bashed/used Mexico to get this support base drooling and frothing and waving US flags made by exploited low-wage workers in third world countries. My take is that America very severely lacks enough common sense to elect someone else in 2020. We'll see, I have been wrong before and I'd be very grateful to be wrong here. Rob
I didn't think it was possible, but it apparently is. I now think even less of Trump after reading what you have posted, jp1.
Like most everything political posted on these forums, it would be better to look at the entirety of something before commenting on it lest you get the wrong idea. It's true that the US and Mexico came to an agreement in principle earlier, but that did not translate into a finalized deal. The 5% tariff that got you so excited is what sealed the deal. It's anybody's guess if it would have happened otherwise.
What exactly did he get this past week that hadn't already been agreed to by mexico previously? This looks more like a face saving effort on trump's part. He may not be particularly intelligent but he's smart enough to know that if he kills the economy he kills his chances for reelection.
What exactly did he get this past week that hadn't already been agreed to by mexico previously?
A signed agreement.
I'd be curious to know if the mexicans were showing signs of backing out from what they had previously agreed to, and if so, why. Honestly, if I were them I'd have wanted to get to a signed agreement since trump is well known for not keeping his word.
gimmethesimplelife
6-10-19, 9:02pm
A signed agreement.While I was waiting in the cashier's line at Food City this morning (Hispanic Grocery Store down the street from me) I heard two customers in front of me saying that Mexico says it never signed an agreement - that the agreement was verbal only - and I went home and looked up online claims to the same. Who knows, but what Mexico is claiming, if true, shoots your claim to smithereens. Who knows what is true and what is not true at this point? I trust Mexico more than Trump, but who knows? Rob
While I was waiting in the cashier's line at Food City this morning (Hispanic Grocery Store down the street from me) I heard two customers in front of me saying that Mexico says it never signed an agreement - that the agreement was verbal only - and I went home and looked up online claims to the same. Who knows, but what Mexico is claiming, if true, shoots your claim to smithereens. Who knows what is true and what is not true at this point? I trust Mexico more than Trump, but who knows? Rob
Other than hearing it on CNN a day or so ago I have no first hand knowledge of exactly how the deal was finalized, but if you have two customers in a Hispanic grocery store saying otherwise I'm okay with you blasting me to wherever smithereens may reside. I do enjoy travel.
Other than hearing it on CNN a day or so ago I have no first hand knowledge of exactly how the deal was finalized, but if you have two customers in a Hispanic grocery store saying otherwise I'm okay with you blasting me to wherever smithereens may reside. I do enjoy travel.
I'm not sure who has more credibility, CNN or the two customers. I’m guessing neither were there, and it probably doesn’t matter anyway.
While I was waiting in the cashier's line at Food City this morning (Hispanic Grocery Store down the street from me) I heard two customers in front of me saying that Mexico says it never signed an agreement - that the agreement was verbal only - and I went home and looked up online claims to the same. Who knows, but what Mexico is claiming, if true, shoots your claim to smithereens.
Mexico released their copy of the agreement today. Can you take your finger off the trigger now?
Mexico released their copy of the agreement today. Can you take your finger off the trigger now?
So what was the new part of the deal they agreed to last week?
So what was the new part of the deal they agreed to last week?
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