Something politically positive.....

[gimmethesimplelife]

I believe many of us may agree on.

I'm beyond impressed and grateful to see Mayor Pete running and being taken seriously at least by some as a candidate.....while being openly gay and married to another man. This to me says a lot about changes in society the past ten years - I could not have seen Mayor Pete running even 10 years ago.....and ten years ago he would not have been legally able to marry his male partner.

Point being - for once I'm seeing some positive change - positive change that Trump to date has not been able to roll back. Rob

[catherine]

And I'm happy to see two females as respected contenders. Maybe that's a much bigger "it's about time" since females represent 51% of the population.

[LDAHL]

It would be even better still if no energy were wasted arguing which group had the superior claim to “our turn” status.

[catherine]

It would be even better still if no energy were wasted arguing which group had the superior claim to “our turn” status.

I don't think it's energy wasted to affirm the progress made in getting two historically dismissed, subjugated and outright hated groups of people to the point at which, after 250 years and 45 presidents, they actually have a shot at the White House.

[LDAHL]

I don't think it's energy wasted to affirm the progress made in getting two historically dismissed, subjugated and outright hated groups of people to the point at which, after 250 years and 45 presidents, they actually have a shot at the White House.

How does asserting “a much bigger about time” contribute to eliminating prejudgment based on identity? How is that not the same old game with different players?

[ToomuchStuff]

How does asserting “a much bigger about time” contribute to eliminating prejudgment based on identity? How is that not the same old game with different players?

Those two groups are bickering and considering calling themselves the Terri's and the Wig parties.:welcome:

[catherine]

How does asserting “a much bigger about time” contribute to eliminating prejudgment based on identity? How is that not the same old game with different players?

The fact is that when you have 50% of the population that are potentially qualified to be president, but have been shut out of the process for hundreds of years, you have to say to yourself it's about time a female is considered a viable candidate. I agree with Rob that it's great that likewise, a gay, married to a male, is not automatically shut out of the process.

Listen, I'm voting for another old white guy, so it's not about pushing an identity politics game for me. It's a simple observation--Kennedy broke the religious barrier; Obama broke the race barrier. Both of those are positive things. Now it's time for women and LGTBQ to break more barriers. I am not judging who deserves to get there first.. it just seems that the pool of female candidates is larger than the pool of LGTBQ candidates, and from a statistical standpoint alone, it's about time for a female to be taken seriously. If you disagree, perhaps you have your own prejudices.

[jp1]

It would also be nice if we hadn't had 44 out of 45 presidents all be straight white men, thus making anyone who isn't, noteworthy.

[ApatheticNoMore]

Hard to tell how much prejudice there really is unless someone was the nominee, with mayor Pete I suspect a lot of latent prejudice would come out (and no I don't mean everyone who isn't a Pete fan is prejudiced AT ALL, people have legitimate criticism and legitimate reasons for supporting other candidates. But *IF* he was the nominee AND they lose Dem turnout in the general I'd tend to see some role of prejudice). Women I don't know, I'd like to think we were WELL beyond that with women, but I don't know (Hillary had a ton of flaws of course, but losing to Trump of all people, you know - maybe we're not).

[flowerseverywhere]

I love Pete. He is very smart, has many great policy ideas, served in the military and is very eloquent. He lacks some experience but that so far hasn’t stopped people from getting elected. His gay status might very well stop him from getting elected. Sadly, I might add.

I don’t think it is a matter of whose turn it is. That talk just adds more divisiveness. We need a candidate who will represent the voters, not just the corporations and wealthy donors who help them get re-elected and more wealthy.

Someone who who is not going to make our uninsured crisis worse. Someone who is not going to insult our allies. Someone who is not going to incite the far right and left extremists to violence, antisemitism and mass shooting. And someone who is going to really support our military, not undermine their authority and devalue years of faithful service.

[LDAHL]

The fact is that when you have 50% of the population that are potentially qualified to be president, but have been shut out of the process for hundreds of years, you have to say to yourself it's about time a female is considered a viable candidate. I agree with Rob that it's great that likewise, a gay, married to a male, is not automatically shut out of the process.

Listen, I'm voting for another old white guy, so it's not about pushing an identity politics game for me. It's a simple observation--Kennedy broke the religious barrier; Obama broke the race barrier. Both of those are positive things. Now it's time for women and LGTBQ to break more barriers. I am not judging who deserves to get there first.. it just seems that the pool of female candidates is larger than the pool of LGTBQ candidates, and from a statistical standpoint alone, it's about time for a female to be taken seriously. If you disagree, perhaps you have your own prejudices.

I don’t disagree. I took the Clinton candidacy very seriously, although not perhaps in the way you would have preferred.

My overall preference would be to evaluate candidates based on individual character, records and policy rather than external characteristics. I don’t think “it’s about time” is a legitimate criterion. It’s just another variant of the prejudice people seem so eager to attribute to others.

[catherine]

My overall preference would be to evaluate candidates based on individual character, records and policy rather than external characteristics.

That's why I'm choosing a particular old, straight white guy.

[Teacher Terry]

Totally agree Rob, Catherine and Flowers!

[LDAHL]

That's why I'm choosing a particular old, straight white guy.

And if we continue evolving, one day you won’t feel the need to list a person’s age, sexual preferences and race to demonstrate your lack of focus on age, sexual preferences and race.

[iris lilies]

10 years ago mayor Pete could have run for President with no prejudice because 10 years ago mayor Pete wasn’t gay.

[catherine]

And if we continue evolving, one day you won’t feel the need to list a person’s age, sexual preferences and race to demonstrate your lack of focus on age, sexual preferences and race.

And if everyone just sat around accepting the status quo without recognizing injustices to those of particular ages, sexual preferences and races, where would we be now?

[gimmethesimplelife]

I don't think it's energy wasted to affirm the progress made in getting two historically dismissed, subjugated and outright hated groups of people to the point at which, after 250 years and 45 presidents, they actually have a shot at the White House.I could not agree with you more, Catherine. Rob

[LDAHL]

And if everyone just sat around accepting the status quo without recognizing injustices to those of particular ages, sexual preferences and races, where would we be now?

Can’t we acknowledge past injustices without resorting to the same sort of identity based thinking that caused them in the first place?

[JaneV2.0]

And if everyone just sat around accepting the status quo without recognizing injustices to those of particular ages, sexual preferences and races, where would we be now?

As long as your ox isn't being gored, who cares? seems to be the idea behind many people's politics.

[catherine]

Can’t we acknowledge past injustices without resorting to the same sort of identity based thinking that caused them in the first place?

Isn't it identity-based thinking that said that blacks have no place in "white" diners or restrooms?
Isn't it identity-based thinking that said that people with AIDS deserved it?
Isn't it identity-based thinking when William F. Buckley, Jr lamented that "the son of an alumnus now has less of a chance of getting [into Yale] than some boy from P.S. 109 somewhere" when legacy admissions were slashed?

Identity-based thinking cuts all ways, doesn't it? It's alright for the ruling elite to cry foul when they haven't been on the other side--when it isn't their mothers like mine who became young widows and couldn't support their families, or when they haven't been profiled by police on the basis of their color, or when they couldn't admit to who they loved for fear of being socially ostracized at best and beat up or killed at worst.

How do you propose we correct injustice without naming it? Shall we all form a circle and sing Kumbaya? Really, I'm open for suggestions.

[bae]

It would also be nice if we hadn't had 44 out of 45 presidents all be straight white men, thus making anyone who isn't, noteworthy.

Were they really *all* straight?

[LDAHL]

How do you propose we correct injustice without naming it? Shall we all form a circle and sing Kumbaya? Really, I'm open for suggestions.

I propose dispensing justice at the retail level rather than the wholesale level, with each case judged on its individual merits.

I propose breaking out of the mindset that each of us is reducible to a set category in a taxonomy of victims and victimizers.

I propose calling injustice “injustice”, with no need for an industry built around attaching modifiers to what should be a simple concept.

I propose judging people by their actions rather than what we intuit the motivations behind their actions to be.

[Alan]

Isn't it identity-based thinking that said that blacks have no place in "white" diners or restrooms?
Isn't it identity-based thinking that said that people with AIDS deserved it?
Isn't it identity-based thinking when William F. Buckley, Jr lamented that "the son of an alumnus now has less of a chance of getting [into Yale] than some boy from P.S. 109 somewhere" when legacy admissions were slashed?
Yes it was, in every case, that's why lots of us believe it's well past time to stop that sort of thinking.

[catherine]

Yes it was, in every case, that's why lots of us believe it's well past time to stop that sort of thinking.

Back from South Carolina, huh, Alan? :). I was wondering why you didn't respond to this discussion earlier.

Anyway, I've said my piece.

[Alan]

Back from South Carolina, huh, Alan? :). I was wondering why you didn't respond to this discussion earlier.

Yep, got home this afternoon and a little sad about it. I could have used another week or two but my wife must be back in school on Monday and we have to do the holiday thing with our daughter and grandkids starting on Friday.

[Teacher Terry]

I hope your wife retires soon Alan.

[Alan]

I hope your wife retires soon Alan.
Thank you! Me too!!

She says one more year before one little girl that's been with her for the past 5 years is promoted out of the unit, so I'm trying to be patient.

[Teacher Terry]

It’s just so nice to be able to travel when you feel like it, go to a movie during the day and not have to plan around a schedule. I love doing spontaneous stuff with DH.