View Full Version : Reincarnation question
Of all the possible afterlife alternatives, reincarnation is one that has made a lot of sense to me. It's been awhile, but I've read quite a few books giving some convincing examples. One thing that has always bothered me that I've never seen addressed is the explanation for the increasing global population. Like exponential. An then you can go back a few centuries and the global population was relatively small.
Are there just new souls being created all the time, and this century it just happens to be in the billions?
Just curious if anyone has heard or read a good explanation for this?
That's my understanding. My parents could probably explain it better. But I think there's thought to be a vast (infinite?) supply of divine energy/God. And new souls come from that. And of course, that is what we're striving to return to. You'll hear talk of old souls and young souls. So the young souls are those that haven't had many life times. Usually these would be described as the people that have more difficulties with life and are all about the quick fun experience. Older souls have more wisdom, experience and tranquility. JMHO from what I've learned and thought about. Reincarnation just feels right to me too.
Maxamillion
7-6-11, 6:18pm
Reincarnation makes sense to me too. I think that older souls can still have lots of difficulty with life...like the difference between first grade homework and twelfth grade homework. Wish there was some Cliff notes! I know once I cross over, I will definitely be having a talk with the big whoever upstairs. Knowing all the horrors that happen all over the world, it's hard for me to imagine why anyone would willingly come to earth. Makes me think the PR committee on the other side must have some fantastic pamphlets for Earth life. >8)
I don't necessarily disagree with the new soul theory. It does, however, discount souls from places other than Earth.
I've never been able to believe in souls, and if I did, I can't fathom it continuing to exist once I was gone, as attractive as that might be.
If you're interested in the idea of reincarnation--as I am--I recommend Dr. Ian Stevenson's exhaustive study of evidence for it. I actually checked out his weighty two-volume set (via inter-library loan) and was impressed by his work and his lifelong devotion to it. There are a couple of books about children and past lives by Carol Bowman I've enjoyed reading, as well.
Jane, I don't believe in reincarnation but I'm getting an ILL book from the library by someone who fancied herself the reincarnation of James VI, King of Scotland. Looking forward to it.
ApatheticNoMore
7-6-11, 10:53pm
I don't believe in reincarnation but it does make sense in a way. All the ways I am "off" that I have never been able to explain despite years of wondering about how my childhood might have contributed (I mean my parents were really crazed in a dozen ways, but even that can't really explain it). Sometimes I think I meet some diagnosis (ok today I'm aspergers or something - but in reality I don't meet any of those diagnosis at all really, I'm just a normal brained human being :P).
But I suppose the proper scientific explanation would be GENES, it's all GENES, ah but a genie seems to make more sense than genes, some spirit from the past that has driven me, that has always driven me, that is what I am.
Let us know what you think of it, Iris Lily. I've read a few thought-provoking reincarnation books, including one about a detective who believes he was an artist in a previous life: Looking for Carroll Beckwith. I have an interesting theory about reincarnation in my family--and it would explain much--but most of my notions are fluid. I'm open to possibility but don't claim to know much of anything for sure.
well, in buddhism, the individual (in so far as one exists) can go several different ways: 1. hungry ghost -- this individual clings to an aspect of life, and therefore stays and suffers because they cannot live as they did, and also cannot seem to move forward; 2. soul smash -- essentially, the person doesn't move forward, nor does s/he cling to the prior life, so the soul becomes fractured or fragmented. this energy/soul stuff then goes out and attracts other fragments (like magnets was the analogy i was given), and then those form a "new soul" and inhabit a being. 3. a person goes bodhisattva-like. that is, they manage to hold their soul together and move forward into rebirth with purpose. 4. a person is a bodhisattva. bodhisattvas take the vow to return to human life and help bring all humans to enlightenment. it's called the bodhisattva vow. 5. the enlightened individual goes to parinirvana. it's possible to not reach enlightenment in life, but accept it in death, and move to parinirvana. This seems to have two variations (from what I can tell), which is that you can maintain your egopersonality for specialty appearances (in dreams, etc) or that you cannot and you simple become part of the totality (infinite potentiality).
One other reason -- not from traditional buddhism -- that I have seen about the increase in population and souls is that you simple have an infinite number of souls arises and resting at all times, and some take body and some don't at any given time, which can allow for population growth. another person alluded to it in a PP.
I don't know a lot about reincarnation, but it feels right to me, too. I think there's something to it.
Just wanted to point out here that there is a difference between reincarnation and rebirth.
One thing I've thought about is that if you are looking at the population numbers as through a supreme being, maybe the population numbers are not that significant. Just a few more or less souls here and there. What are billions relative to infinity? I started thinking about how time is not really linear and how that relate to the number of souls. Then my head started to hurt. I can remember reading that this was an important time in our history for many souls to experience for their growth. So many have chosen to return to the earth plane. I think this last one was a little new-agey.
I have also wondered if some of the new souls with little experience can be identified by having their jean wasteline worn at the knee and hats with the bill facing backwards.
The population growth thing always bothered me too. There are more people alive right now than in the whole history of the earth combined.
And how come when someone has a past life regression, they always seem to be some famous or rich person in a past life. Seems a little fishy to me because 99% of all people are just ordinary people, not privileged at all.
This discussion has also discounted the trillions and trillions of animals and insects.
And how come when someone has a past life regression, they always seem to be some famous or rich person in a past life. Seems a little fishy to me because 99% of all people are just ordinary people, not privileged at all.
If anyone were keeping track, I'll bet we'd find that many of them were the same famous person in a past life.
Rogar - you cracked me up!
Xmac - I think you've got something there!
loosechickens
7-8-11, 11:50pm
Well, after all, who wants to admit that in a previous life they were a ****roach? No wonder everybody claims to have been Cleopatra or Mozart........wouldn't you, given the choice, hahahaha?
NOW I begin to understand why I feel compelled to fish out all the struggling bees, wasps and yes, even ****roaches, that, being thirsty, fall into the swimming pool. Maybe at some level I understand that I used to be one of their relatives, so am more ready to practice compassion..........
edited to add: I can't BELIEVE that the computer program would **** that out.....I wonder if it will let me say it in Spanish, "la cucaracha"
My only question about reincarnation is, if we're supposed to take learnings from one life to the other, what purpose does it serve if we're not conscious of those lessons? Do we move ahead better without that consciousness? For example, if I'm a smoker in this life, and I die and am reincarnated, would my memories of smoking help or hinder me in my next life? I wonder. Or, what if you committed a serious crime and therefore you came back with heavy karma baggage--is it better that you don't know why you were given this baggage?
Just curious.
My only question about reincarnation is, if we're supposed to take learnings from one life to the other, what purpose does it serve if we're not conscious of those lessons? Do we move ahead better without that consciousness? For example, if I'm a smoker in this life, and I die and am reincarnated, would my memories of smoking help or hinder me in my next life? I wonder. Or, what if you committed a serious crime and therefore you came back with heavy karma baggage--is it better that you don't know why you were given this baggage?
Just curious.
Isn't that basically one of the questions that holds true for all belief in the afterlife? If there truely is something after death, why is it that we are not given direct knowledge of it? We pretty much have to go with what the great masters have told us and add in a little (or a lot) of faith.
What about simply moving from one plane of experience to another? this skips all the talk about reincarnation and rebirth and makes one responsible for one's own actions and life.
There are at least three explanations I am aware of. Firstly, there is no reason to assume that times between reincarnations are always the same. It appears that intervalls in the past could have been much longer than now. Secondly, there is no reason to assume that we incarnate only on earth, places like Sirius and Pleiades have been mentioned. It appears that Earth is presently a place of intensive learning. Thirdly, It appears that a soul can incarnate many simultaneous personalities. I must admit I read least about the process of creating souls. Anybody there who knows more?
Haran
So how much time elapses between death and rebirth? Do you travel with the same people?
Curious as to where and how the various religions believe all the souls originated in the first place. Back in college I had a comparative religion class and if I remember correctly most (Buddhism and Hinduism) said that they were always in existence. What or who created the souls? Where do they exist when "out of body"? And, why does everyone's previous life been of someone who is an illustrious person (I was Cleopateria in my last life, etc...) and no one is ever the chamber pot cleaner :-) Enquirering minds want to know!
This discussion has also discounted the trillions and trillions of animals and insects.
Yes, this is my understanding too. That, at least to the Cambodian and Vietnamese Buddhist I know, one can reincarnate downward to an animal or insect even if they had attained the human stage. Not sure what acts or bad behaviors would cause a human to reincarnate as an insect the next time around, nor who or what would be the determining moral factor as to what is "good" karma or "bad" karma for each act.
My take on it is that you have modern past life regressions through hypnosis and then core religious beliefs that are mostly ancient. In past life regressions there are examples of historical events that were discovered through hyponisis that were later verified, but it also seems like the imagination or subconcious tends to make up things that may relate to famous figures or historical events that the person knows has learned about in news, stories or books. Not all past life regressions involve famous people, but it does seem like a mix of uncanny evidence and imagined historical events.
Reincarnation is not neccessarily based in eastern religions. If I recall my history correctly, there were a few early Christian sects that believed in reincarnation based on the gospels. When the final version of the Bible was established in the 4th century (by what I recall as Catholics), much of the reincarnation texts were edited out. Some due to the perceived invalidity of the texts, but some at the discretion of the editors. Still, I don't think that Christianity and reincarnation are incompatible.
Bastelmutti
7-21-11, 1:00pm
Very interesting discussion. Reincarnation makes sense to me on a basic level as well. At the very least, we disintegrate into the earth, and all those atoms go somewhere and ultimately become something else. That's reincarnation, too.
If anyone has any other book recommendations, I'd love to hear them.
Very interesting discussion. Reincarnation makes sense to me on a basic level as well. At the very least, we disintegrate into the earth, and all those atoms go somewhere and ultimately become something else. That's reincarnation, too.
If anyone has any other book recommendations, I'd love to hear them.
On Jane's recommendation, I googled Ian Stevenson. Really interesting. I'm sure his books would be a good way to learn more (maybe a little scientifically dense, but perhaps depends on your tolerance for that--Jane, your thoughts?)
Stevenson's books aren't easy reading, or as engaging as, say, Carol Bowman's. But if your library has one, it's worth dipping into.
According to many anecdotal reports, it's not unusual for relatives, friends, or other associates to reincarnate together. I read a book called Mission to Millboro some years ago that brought this concept to new heights (or new lows). Its whole premise stretched my pretty elastic credulity to its limits.
James Leininger's story, Soul Survivor is an interesting one. As a boy, he had horrific nightmares related to being shot out of the sky, and as the story developed, he provided clues to a previous life as a fighter pilot.
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