just giving up being independant

[Zoe Girl]

Okay I know I post about wanting to develop my career and then post about no hope and previously posted about my boyfriend so I must seem like a very unstable person. But really, in the next month I think I need to decide if I can continue to try and make it here in Denver or if I need to move to a smaller and cheaper place here (and not have room for my oldest child which means she can't pay me back what she owes because she would have to pay more rent overnight) or move to live with my parents in another state and get back on my feet. Of course I would need a job first, not just counting on subbing because my exhusband was laid off and I have to cover insurance now for the kids.

I am just really having a hard time. Honestly I am one of the smartest people in the room wherever I go, not ego but in grades and accomplishements this is what is true. I have 3 kids that struggle but I take really good care of them. My son is in a special arts school and is finally getting settled there and feeling more confident. My parents have offered to help financially but I am just a sinking ship, I could take a lot of their money and still not make it but meanwhile they have a big house and so it wouldn't cost more to have us there (I would work of course and contribute so there is not an extra cost of food or utlities).

And I don't want to go into work with yet another crisis, a great job where they value me and i really like but making well under 30K is not possible. If the kids dad was a reasonable human i would send the kids there to get on my feet, I think emotionally they would be wrecks. I am finally in a work place where I feel good, and honestly I am pretty angry but mostly scared. I have started talking to my ex boyfriend a little, he has been working super hard on himself and that is good, but this is not the point to put a huge emotional burden in a relationship that is still fragile. All the people who tell me to go date, ha. I mean I am not fun to be around right now, I am a fun person but I am pretty damned stressed. And most people have some great quick answer but I don't think anyone sees the whole picture like I am living with.

Okay going to get money out of savings to cover a few things and eat a few days.

[Valley]

Maybe the best thing to do right now is to really consider moving in with your parents. You really do need to take care of yourself in order to take care of your children. I know that you hate to uproot your children...but sometimes in life we simply have no choice in what we want to do. You sound very fragile and emotionally spent. Would your parents be a supportive force for you or would they just be another stress factor in your life? Only you know the answer to that question. Could you talk this through with your counselor and see if you could gain any insight? Best of luck to you Zoe in whatever you decide to do!

[sweetana3]

I think having a support system is a pretty great thing. It has become a normal thing to do now to help out parents or kids of all ages. It will continue to be necessary and much more ordinary. It is a good thing for both sides if they go into it with love and compromise. Let your parents know what is actually going on. Be honest on what you need and what it means. Show them your budget and ask for them to help make suggestions. Now is not the time for pride. Please allow that they may have many good suggestions and give them the chance to help. You have not failed!! You are incredibly strong to take on all the demands being made on you. You are asking for some of their strength and maybe financial help to climb the mountain right now that the economy has made even taller and steeper for many.

I dont know where they live but getting out of a high cost metro area can be a good thing. Uprooting can be a good thing too and just to move to a smaller and cheaper place is the way to go. Your daughter can sleep on a sofa since it is always hoped to be a temp thing. Dont spend money on space you dont absolutely need. Dont count on your daughter to pay you back either. She is going to face many of the stresses that you are encountering and is just starting out. It will help you in the long run mentally to just mark it off as a gift and be surprised later if you get any money back.

[ApatheticNoMore]

Would your parents be a supportive force for you or would they just be another stress factor in your life?

+1 How do you get along with your parents psychologically? What was it really like there? Sometimes economics has to trump even this, but these are serious questions.

[Gardenarian]

I'm not clear - do your parents live close enough to you so that your kids could continue in the same schools? That would be a big factor for me.
It sounds like you need some unconditional TLC and if your parents are there for you, I would certainly ask them for help.

[Zoe Girl]

Thank you all, I think i need to freak out now and then. Well I do too much, but sometimes it is really wearing me down. I figured out that losing my dog, my relationship and having my daughter crash the car in the last few weeks has been too much.

So my parents live in another state and we get along okay, that would take away the super cool school for my son. That is a huge factor. Also just getting the kids on my insurance, I don't want to mess up their insurance. So looking at moving here sounds better, I just get scared of the process of moving again, downsizing even more (last year did about half of everything I owned) and seeing if my credit is okay yet. Most of all I need a nice long break and that is not happening. I cam close to sending kids to dad for a month, didn;'t happen, worked all summer instead of taking the school break like other school employees, and

Okay darn it, work calls

[Stella]

I would vote for moving. For years now you have seemed like you are on the edge of an emotional and financial meltdown. That can't be good for you or your kids. I wouldn't normally suggest that kids move away from their dad, but sometimes things are what they are. You can't make ends meet in Denver. You have given it everything you have and it isn't enough. 2+2 just isn't going to equal 5 and the gap has to be covered somehow.

FWIW I like living with my dad. We get long well and there's a lot of security for everyone in a combined household.

[Wildflower]

I think maybe you should move in with your parents. Probably would take a huge burden off your shoulders, and you and your kids would get a new start, which would probably be a really good thing for all of you. Denver is very expensive, living somewhere else cheaper would be great for you as well... Best wishes whatever you decide to do.

[razz]

Zoegirl, think about moving differently so that your kids will look at it differently.
Families used to live together until the past hundred years when cheap oil made for more independence of jobs, heat, transportation etc.

What is needed is a clear set of boundaries worked out with your kids and parents so that you all understand what is expected, strictly taboo and an ongoing way to discuss emerging issues. If your parents and your kids are able to accept this, then consider moving with your parents.

Most grandparents are truly wonderful with the grandchildren giving them a kind of support and love that no one else can possibly do. Your kids need this and you need their support and need to give your support to them (kids and parents) as well. It does not have to lopsided as you now seem to be thinking.

Your parents will have a routine of their own with their friends and community that needs to continue for their mental health so figure out a way to be less intrusive in their lives in setting the boundaries. Your kids are growing up and need some space so having both you and your parents monitoring every move will be stressful so figure out who will parent and be clear that it is only one set of eyes and accountibility.

It is your parents' home so boundaries need to be set about cleanliness, etc (like what to do with wet towels or clothes to be washed or special diet) without causing offense to either of the parties.

Money is tension inducing so be clear about transparency there.

It is doable if everyone tries to understand that there will be some challenges that need to be resolved as they arise and your parents will thoroughly enjoy having some vitality in their lives.

[Aqua Blue]

Can you legally move your children that far from their father? A friend of mine wanted to move closer to her family, but her divorce degree only allowed her to move within a 50 mile radius of her ex. I realize that moving would help your son not have to deal with his father.

Also, are your parents really willing to do this? It would be a big adjustment for them. I can see more difficulties if they aren''t 100% behind it.

[chanterelle]

Zoe, you mentioned that your parents offered money, did they also offer to have you and kids move in with them??...are they aware that you are even considering it??? Writing checks is very different from having your grown daughter and 3 semi adult kids move back in. Don't even condider this as an option until you and your parents are very clear on this issue.
In other posts you say that you have a therapist that you see from time to time. It sounds like you need to make regular visits at this time. If money is an issue this is a good time to take up your parents offer of cash. If time is the issue, your kids need to start pulling their weight to take over the chores so that you can make appointments. They either move out of their comfort zone now or have their life completely disrupted because you can no longer cope.
Sound logica land professional help is needed here before you make any life altering moves. I wish you well as this is a very difficult time for you, your children and your parents.

[Zoe Girl]

Right now with the custody, my son's school and the fact that I have insurance on my kids through work means that a big move may not be possible yet. I am going to talk to my counselor and look at those apartments. The ex can be rotten but he is doing more, like he set up everything for my oldest to get her wisdom teeth out before his insurance runs out including taking her at 7 am and paying the copays. If I had a good job offer out of state then I think I would have to push it or insist he adjust the child support. It was set up when he covered their insurance which had a huge employer contribution so he paid almost nothing. Mine is good, mine is paid for and everything for the kids is $300 a month, dental vision and health.

So I see the counselor and I see what may be stressful about this for everyone, that is what is the hardest. I am burned out on the day to day push from the kids. It has taken them the last year to really get it through their heads that we do not have the same standard of living, I know they are teens and this is hard. To move even smaller now that they are just settled is something that is hard for me too. Last night and the day before however I had some positives from them. like not pushing to get convenience food instead of a lot of food we can cook and saying nice things to younger brother because he cleaned the house top to bottom.

Thanks all,

[San Onofre Guy]

Are your parents, and your ex's parents willing to assist with a cash payment on a monthly basis? I don't know many grandparents who would not want to assist. Most grandparents overlook what issues they may have with their kid or kids ex and would like to assist their grandchildren. Could each set of grandparents assist to the tune of $250 per month? I suspect that $500 per month might go a long way to making life easier for you. Remember that for you as well as your parents that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Kids do grow up and move out and then the financial equation changes considerably.

[sweetana3]

My husband and I pay that and more for his mother and father(while he was alive) and we considered it a blessing to be able to help. It is when mom does not tell us of major problems and then hits us with a major crisis that we are frustrated and angry with her.

[ApatheticNoMore]

For years now you have seemed like you are on the edge of an emotional and financial meltdown. That can't be good for you or your kids.

Yea, but it makes me wonder if any of these issues stem from childhood, and if so, moving in with the parents may not be wise. But really these are things to speak to a counselor that knows you well about.

It would relieve the financial strain that may be a cause of so much of the problems. But there are other possible ways to resolve this also, perhaps just moving somewhere cheaper that isnt' into the parents house. Perhaps moving to the parents town but having your own place (this sets up very critical boundaries wtih the parents, yea the kids see their grandparents, they can maybe babysit when necessary and take some strain off you, you might even go over there for dinner sometimes etc. - but you are still for most intents and purposes a self-supporting adult and that sets boundaries). Although even paying rent to the parents may set some boundaries. Also do you have a support network in your town? If you have friends and so on you turn to for support it might be an incentive to stay (not necessarily strong enough if you are drowining financially, just somehing to consider).

For me feeling insecure in my unemployment and asking my parents if they would help me out if I ran out of money (and this is not imminent! this would not happen for a few years!) suddenly regressed me a great deal. I suddenly became this person who worried: "mommy might not approve of me taking this class and spending money on it, mommy does not approve of it, I'd better not do it". Um good grief, at my age :laff: But that's just me and I would definitely label my birth family as somewhat dysfunctional.

[Aqua Blue]

Yea, but it makes me wonder if any of these issues stem from childhood, and if so, moving in with the parents may not be wise. But really these are things to speak to a counselor that knows you well about.

It would relieve the financial strain that may be a cause of so much of the problems. But there are other possible ways to resolve this also, perhaps just moving somewhere cheaper that isnt' into the parents house. Perhaps moving to the parents town but having your own place (this sets up very critical boundaries wtih the parents, yea the kids see their grandparents, they can maybe babysit when necessary and take some strain off you, you might even go over there for dinner sometimes etc. - but you are still for most intents and purposes a self-supporting adult and that sets boundaries). Although even paying rent to the parents may set some boundaries. Also do you have a support network in your town? If you have friends and so on you turn to for support it might be an incentive to stay (not necessarily strong enough if you are drowining financially, just somehing to consider).

For me feeling insecure in my unemployment and asking my parents if they would help me out if I ran out of money (and this is not imminent! this would not happen for a few years!) suddenly regressed me a great deal. I suddenly became this person who worried: "mommy might not approve of me taking this class and spending money on it, mommy does not approve of it, I'd better not do it". Um good grief, at my age :laff: But that's just me and I would definitely label my birth family as somewhat dysfunctional.

But Mommy should be able to approve or disapprove if she is footting the bill IMHO>8). Why should Mommy have to give up her privacy etc and not have any say?

[ApatheticNoMore]

But Mommy should be able to approve or disapprove if she is footting the bill IMHO. Why should Mommy have to give up her privacy etc and not have any say?

Maybe, that's why I say know on a deep level what psychological dynamics you are getting yourself into (all families are different so this requires introspection and self-knowledge). And then decide whether it is good or not. Me personally, I hope to never live under my parents guilt-tripping and disapproval ever again.

[Aqua Blue]

I was thinking about this some more this afternoon. And quite honestly I know quite a few friends who have taken adult children and their offspring in due to job loss, divorce etc . I can't think of anyone where it really went well. They all complained blatantly about their children's parenting, about the constant activity, about too much work, etc.

There was a woman in my Bible study who was sooo open about her daughter coming an living with her thru a rough spot. I think she felt really really put upon by her daughter and the children. After they moved out they have had very little to do with each other. The couple across the street from me took in their daughter and two children. She complains every chance she gets at how her daughter doesn't do enough around the house. How she is very tired of snacks and dishes all over the house. I think it is a slippery slope. Parents have a right to their own house with its rules , guilt tripping and disapproval. They spent their time raising kids. They earned the right to have it their way in my opinion.

I know there are situations when it works, but I think like Stella's situation you have to come into it as equals. You both have to have something to contribute of value. I don't think it works well when one of the parties is very needy and not coping well. My parents are both long gone. I don't have children. I did have my sister live with me for 10 weeks this spring. JMO

[Zoe Girl]

Thanks for lots to think about, I know I would not want to leave certain supports I have. However some of my best friends are trying to leave Denver as well. I am looking at how to stay and save money as a first plan. I also want to be very careful with my parents money. Honestly I keep on running the numbers and it seems like I should be able to make it. So I am going to work hard on the budget and get the kids on board with things like a food budget. They can all cook and do a good job at that. I am aware that my parents and I would have some conflicts in how we live, but I would do my best to respect their rules and house and contribute financially if I ever need to do that.

Okay, might as well tell since I have not really kept it a secret in other areas. A few months ago my long time diagnoses of depression was changed to bipolar. It fits when you consider the range of bipolar and hopefully this will affect my life between treating it correctly and the knowledge of it all. So I am not stable yet, I am worrking up slowly on meds (please I would rather not discuss the med part of this, the stigma of it and medication is hard enough). I am really having a hard time with the impact of another lifetime issue and all that it means, it has affected me to overreact and break up with boyfriend, stressed out friendships, and I really didn't know what was going on. So what happens is a few times a year when my life is stressful I fall apart for a day or so, takes about 36 hours to get back to feeling things again that are not the end of the world, but until that time passes I don't snap out of it. I am trying to find a way to not go through this and put others through it. It is very good that my family is behind me but since the time has passed I still see that my budget is not adding up when I take away the 2nd job and add kids insurance, however I don't feel crushed by it. Good news is that I have been really functional for my life (45 years), the stress of everything pushed me over like a lot of people who do not have the same mental issues.

Okay, well that is a large part of why I was freaking out but it doesn't change the underlying facts

[razz]

{{{{{Zoegirl}}}}}

[Zoe Girl]

Thank you razz, that is a good thing right? LOL, see sense of humor is back