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Hi all. I have a question I'm hoping you all wouldn't mind answering for me. One of our personal goals is to eventually not only live a debt free life, but also live well below our means. To that end we are examining housing options for our future when we move closer to retirement. Living with just what we need space wise is important to us, though we do need a home office/ studio space as I am an artist. So I'm looking at the following housing options: Apartment, condo, mobile home, small cabin or small stick built home. City, small town or out in the sticks....
I'm wondering if you all would mind sharing your experiences (pros and cons) with the type of housing you have right now as well as the pros and cons of it's location. It would really helps us consider all the angles as well as financial issues (like association fees, land rental, etc.. as well as maintance issues).
We have a while before we have to consider all this, but I want to gather as much information as possible. Hearing from people actually living in these settings will help us make a more informed choice when the time comes.
This board has been great in getting us to think about a smaller home, living with only what we really need etc.. So for this added in formation I thank you in advance.
DH and I rent a 2 bedroom apartment right now - about 900 sq ft as it's decent size for an apartment. It is in a largish 14 story concrete-constructed building with a lot of seniors. There is a no pet policy. For location I'm not sure what you mean - city/state in general, or location within the city. We're in Canada so it is a large city that is smaller than Toronto/Vancouver. We live in a an area far enough from downtown to be pretty quiet, but not so far as to have no amenities.
Pros:
- 0 maintenance - if something is broken they fix it (not common to all apartments, but here they are pretty good)
- can leave the apartment alone for long periods
- building is quiet (related to neighbours, rules and construction method - again, not all apartments like this)
- in-suite storage room
- ideal location on a creek with walking paths so we can theoretically walk for hours without being beside a major street
- close to a major road with excellent bus routes (we share a car and I bus a lot) but set back far enough (10 min walk) to not hear the road
- tons of shopping and other services within walking distance
Cons:
- can't garden other than a few containers on balcony
- no private yard of our own (but we don't want the hassle right now anyhow)
- rent increases - the standard is about 2.5% but they can apply for a larger increase. This year it's about 6% unfortunately
- heat is not included here (heat being included is really a pro for us about most apartments) so electricity bill is high
- no covered parking
- no in-suite washer/dryer (I'd prefer an apartment to have this)
- no ability to change things - the carpets are ok for somethings but overall we'd rather not have them
Overall, it suits us well, especially now when we're both working full time. I really feel that we shouldn't own a house until at least one of us is working only part time. We like lots of down time and aren't big fans of home maintenance. Our main complaint has nothing to do with the apartment or it's location within the city. It's the overall geographical location. This city is just too cold. Outdoor activities are severely restricted for many months. As soon as it's feasible and definitely upon retirement we'll move to another city - either BC or east coast (possibly summers in the east coast and winters in BC or in the US.)
SO and I rent a good sized (1200 sq foot) apartment in a new building in a large american city. The apartment is about right for both of us, although I could easily live in less than half the space if I lived alone.
Pros:
Convenient location. Light rail stop right out front. Easy to get to work or go out for dinner or whatever.
Landlord takes care of all maintenence.
Apartment is really well thought out and designed.
View of the ocean 2 miles away - beautiful sunsets
Laundry in the apartment
No yard to take care of
Much cheaper monthly outlay in rent then the costs of purchasing a comparable place
Major grocery store(safeway) right across the street.
Zipcars in the building garage. Cheaper than owning a car but just as convenient for occasional shopping trips or day trips out of town on the weekends.
Cons:
Living in the city is significantly more expensive then living in neighboring suburbs
Truthfully I don't have much negative to say about this place. It's pretty much exactly the type of place I want to live and is reasonably priced for this city. We can easily afford it and still save a decent amount, so I'm happy here.
We downsized almost 4 years ago. We (just hubby, me and our dog) live in a 100 year old cabin that is 465 sq. ft with a 235 sq. ft. laundry/storage room. Our front room is our kitchen, desk/computer area and office for a small 3 unit motel that we operate. We have a living room with a small dining table which we eat our meals at. There is one bedroom with a small bathroom. Our clothes closets are in the utility room which also has a pantry and a drop down drying rack to hang my laundry on in the winter. Behind the laundry room we have a greenhouse which is passive solar heated and we use it to grow veggies. Under the greenhouse is a cold room to store my preserves. Outside we have raised gardens to grow veggies and hubby has a heated garage/workshop which he enjoys. The house is all on one level (except the cold room) which will be nice as we get older. Because it is small, it is easy to maintain and heating/electric costs are lower due to the size. We tend not to clutter the space with "stuff" because we just don't have any space and that saves us money as well.
We live in a semi-isolated village that is 19 km. from shopping. We enjoy fresh air, wildlife and friendlly neighbours. I would never want to live in a city again. I hope to live here until I take my last breath.
I didn't want to rent, because over time rents always rise. In retirement, your income is usually fixed, so you want to keep the rising expenses to a minimum. I also didn't want a condo or anything with homeowners fees, for the same reason. Also, I wasn't thrilled with the idea of other people making up rules about pets and gardens and etc. And I don't like hearing OPN (Other People's Noise) through my walls. And (re: renting) I did not like the idea of living anywhere where I could be thrown out for any reason. But I was a renter for a long time, so have some negative issues.
So I bought a house in a small town in Oklahoma. It was affordable, I own it outright, the neighborhood is quiet, the property taxes are low. Of course, I am responsible now for insurance and upkeep, etc., but I can make choices about those things. And the housing here is reasonably priced for people of modest means.
I wanted to live somewhere walkable, so when the time comes that I can't drive any longer I'd still be able to get where I needed to go. There is literally nothing here that I couldn't walk to. Might be a long walk, but it's do-able. There is also some public transportation. Within walking distance is a market and the library -- probably the two things I enjoy most. Also several thrift shops and a farmers market in the summer.
I wanted a garden and chickens. I have those now.
So I live in Mayberry now. And I love it. :D
I just have to say from an observation of my parents: most people, even those who have healthy adult lives and who take very good care of their bodies, eventually wear down and start to fall apart. We all want to be that proverbial "amazing senior" who kicks butt 24-7, but that's very "Disney-esque" thinking: some people are that way, but odds are against it. I hope to move to my "final house" within about 5 years. And yes, I will be thinking in terms of proximity to a hospital, number of stairs, handicapped access, live in help, and a tight community that helps its members. I'm certainly not planning on being "old" any time soon, I'm only 48! But I certainly don't want to have to destroy the whole life I've spent creating just because I become old. Really old, not Disney old, with stiff creaky joints and fragile hips and less stamina and energy than is required to be a woodswoman pioneer. It's an old idea coming new again: choose a place to build a life, then create a home that lets you stay there.
I didn't want to rent, because over time rents always rise. In retirement, your income is usually fixed, so you want to keep the rising expenses to a minimum. I also didn't want a condo or anything with homeowners fees, for the same reason. Also, I wasn't thrilled with the idea of other people making up rules about pets and gardens and etc. And I don't like hearing OPN (Other People's Noise) through my walls. And (re: renting) I did not like the idea of living anywhere where I could be thrown out for any reason. But I was a renter for a long time, so have some negative issues.
So I bought a house in a small town in Oklahoma. It was affordable, I own it outright, the neighborhood is quiet, the property taxes are low. Of course, I am responsible now for insurance and upkeep, etc., but I can make choices about those things. And the housing here is reasonably priced for people of modest means.
I wanted to live somewhere walkable, so when the time comes that I can't drive any longer I'd still be able to get where I needed to go. There is literally nothing here that I couldn't walk to. Might be a long walk, but it's do-able. There is also some public transportation. Within walking distance is a market and the library -- probably the two things I enjoy most. Also several thrift shops and a farmers market in the summer.
I wanted a garden and chickens. I have those now.
So I live in Mayberry now. And I love it. :D
But it is in Oklahoma Crystal.cow-hi
Where will you be living? This gives a lot of info on utility need, space need, costs, etc. For example, I would give completely different answers if you say you want to live in SF or NM.
Can you live work in a 2 bedroom apartment or do you need a lot of studio space? What financial constraints are you facing?
Do you have any outside interests? One poster mentioned gardening and that would create different issues.
Do you need a garage? For my husband, it is a requirement.
In our city, there are reasonable SFHs of all sizes and quality. If you own your own home, you are required to do all the maintenance and cough up the costs. There are all kinds of condos from high rise to over 55 patio homes and everything in between. Beware of getting a well managed condo with good reserves. Lots of issues here but we have our eye on one development that is considered the best managed in town for purchase in around 10 years when we want to get rid of the SFH.
We also have all kinds of apartments in all sizes including over 55 units. The usual issues here of pet policies and such. We do have some hard to qualify for income supported apartments where the rent is 30% of income. There are new and older units. The cost of an over 55 complex with bus service and utilities is around $600-700 per month. No garage and the largest units are one bedroom (no studio space).
Personally, I like a bigger city (around 1 million) for the services (professional and retail) and the competition that helps to keep prices down. We have numerous farmers markets including a winter one that is inside. I like a SFH because we have cats and a lot of stuff. Plus we needed a garage. We live downtown and have access to the whole city with the benefit of a quiet neighborhood. It would be a good place to stay. I would never be able to live in the sticks or a small country town. Doesn't fit our personalities.
I recommend deciding where you would like to live and then investigate the types of housing available.
I can't believe I accidentally deleted what I just wrote. Here goes again. I have been in my current home for almost 7 years. I moved here from the beach as part of a major life change. I was a stressed out paralegal and then found out that my sister was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. That was a wakeup call for me. She died one week after I moved. I sold my condo at the beach at the "top" of the market, so I also bought albeit in a less expensive area at the top of the market. I own a single story townhouse of just under 1300 sq ft. I could live in half that but here I am. I am single, 66 years old, living with my 17 year old Burmese cat. It has been a long adjustment for me because I lived at the coast for more than 30 years. However, over time I have come to appreciate and love where I am now - still in SoCal but about 50 minutes to the beach.
I work with and see my two grown sons every day. I am a grandmother of 3 little ones, two of whom live 5 minutes from me. My dad is in assisted living about 10 minutes from me. Being close to family has become a real blessing. I am also close to a hospital, a major shopping area, library, grocery stores, and other amenities.
Recently, I had to replace my HVAC system at a cost of $5,000. I have also replaced windows and had built-in bookshelves installed in my 2nd bedroom. I would like to finish replacing windows, upgrade my fireplace, and do some interior painting. But I intend to hold off until I can pay for these things in cash.
I have gone back and forth with the idea of selling or renting out my townhouse and then renting an apartment. My family develops, builds and manages affordable, rental housing in the Old Town. The units are small and efficient and situated within walking distance of restaurants, coffee houses, a community theatre, and wine bars, etc. It would be fun. However, I really do have everything I want and need right where I am. Sometimes, I think many of us are looking for the "perfect" place to live, not realizing that we might already have it.
I still have energy and health to do what I want to do. I think I could live where I am until my 80s, God willing, as long as my health holds out. My dad is now 90 and moved into assisted living about 6 months ago. It has been a real adjustment for him. He gave up his car (he was still driving!) when he moved and so he is limited in his day-to-day activities. I visit him often and take him to church, etc. It has been an "eye opener" for me to see how people get along in advanced age. It definitely takes "grit" and the ability to adapt. My father was very smart about his future. About 7 years ago he purchased an annuity for cash, the purpose of which was to help financially if he required assisted living. It has been a godsend for him because he is able to live in a beautiful setting, whereas, without the annuity he would probably be relegated to a somewhat undesirable living arrangement.
Anyway, I think retirement can be so very rewarding as long as one can adapt and has done some planning. For sure, it ain't for sissies!
Linda
[QUOTE=sweetana3;4145]Where will you be living? We will be staying in New Hampshire.
Can you live work in a 2 bedroom apartment or do you need a lot of studio space?
An apartment is doable, but may be a challenge in bringing people in to purchase work.
What financial constraints are you facing?
We don't know the answer to that yet. Right now we are living on approx $45,000 a year income.
Do you have any outside interests? One poster mentioned gardening and that would create different issues.
Nothing that I need to have a special space for.
Do you need a garage? For my husband, it is a requirement.
No garage needed, just a car port. However we do need reliable internet access. Here in NH some parts of the state do not have internet service or they have intermitent internet/cell service.
You might want to look into some co-op type options for studio workspace/sales. Several people we know have moved their work spaces into what were once retail malls. They have events, they have traffic, they have 'a community of like-minded people', they have a place outside their home for their workspace. We're going to look into that option for ourselves. I know of 2 malls in St Louis that are renting out retail storefronts to artists for $100 month rent to keep the building occupied (The retail malls of the 80's are so over with).
Currently our glass studio is in a 30x24 detatched barn-style garage next to our house. We live in a rural neighborhood and it's not conducive to having buyers come by or offering classes. As we get older and the cost of traveling for art shows continues to climb it would be nice to have a studio/shop/sales space that is part of something bigger. It would be easier to sell or rent out when my DH reaches the age where he just can't lug around the thousands of pounds of stuff in raw material or finished product/display stuff.
Currently we feel very stuck. We can't just up and sell our house because our work is right next door and it's really hard to move all the equipment from one studio to another so when we do we want it to be....the last move.
[QUOTE=Float On;4171]You might want to look into some co-op type options for studio workspace/sales. Several people we know have moved their work spaces into what were once retail malls. They have events, they have traffic, they have 'a community of like-minded people', they have a place outside their home for their workspace.
A Friend of mine just moved into a space in a city about 30 mins south of us and is giving that a try. Our city doesn't have an arts community so we don't have that option here in town. I'd have to travel 30 minutes to get a town that did. I'm not sure that's worth the daily commute. I'm still looking into it.
Knowing where you want to live is the hardest part. Since it is a relatively small state, you can more easily pinpoint those areas that have the maximum number of "pros" on your list of must haves. Then do the research on what is available. We can suggest a lot of things that may or may not be available. For example, in the town you love, there may not be any adaptable senior housing. It is really limited where my inlaws live in NY and if available, hard to get into.
In the NE, I would be wary of the heating source and carefully consider cost now and potential cost in the future. I have known people who think they will heat with wood they cut themselves and have not considered the time and physical strength needed to keep a woodpile going. I would be looking for a very energy efficient heating source. As we get older, we tend to want a warmer living space and costs can creep up.
For later stages of life, consider safety features such as grab bars, proper entry and exits (without stairs), sufficient space in bathroom for assistant devices. I am only mentioning this since our inlaws have all these issues.
I haven't read all the posts yet so if this has been said already - sorry. But have you thought of a retirement community? Not an old folks rest home, but an "active" adult community? Someplace like the various Sun City's in Arizona or Calif. that have either regular houses or small condos or co-ops. They usually have tons of amenities that even a 20 year old would be envious of, plus they are set up with many services for seniors so that you can grow old there with minimal hassle or need to move. They are also usually much less expensive to buy than a regular home. My Mom lived in a seniors co-op community (55 and over) 2 miles from the beach in southern Calif. called Leisure World (www.lwsb.com). It was a gated community of about 10,000, had every leisure activity and club you could imagine, 6 clubhouses, small golf course, swimming pool, gym, several churches, post office, various hobby shops (wood working, ceramics, etc...), an outdoor ampitheatre with weekly free entertainment (Pat Boone, etc.. will be Led Zep when I live there:-)!, community buses that also went "outside" to local shopping centers and hospitals, a medical center, community gardens, rv and boat parking, etc... etc... and on and on. The prices vary from $50K for a basic one bedroom (600sf) up to around $150K or so for a two bedroom corner unit. All one story. A companion place called Laguna Woods (www.lagunawoodsvillage.com) has even more stuff and is much larger with tiny places to million dollar houses, 18 hole golf course, horse stables, etc.. My Mom bought into the co-op in 1996 and paid $27,000 for a furnished place. Her monthly fee was under $200/month and that included her prop. taxes, all utilities except electric and phone, and all maintenance (even indoor). It a place I've thought of moving to once I was 55 and only had one dog.
I haven't read all the posts yet so if this has been said already - sorry. But have you thought of a retirement community? Not an old folks rest home, but an "active" adult community?
I have looked into them and to be honest, that is not a lifestyle I would want. I just don't find these communitites appealing. I don't want stuff like gyms or swimming pools or activities rooms and such. Nor would I want my monthly fee going to pay for things I'll never use.
I haven't read all the posts yet so if this has been said already - sorry. But have you thought of a retirement community? Not an old folks rest home, but an "active" adult community?
I have looked into them and to be honest, that is not a lifestyle I would want. I just don't find these communitites appealing. I don't want stuff like gyms or swimming pools or activities rooms and such. Nor would I want my monthly fee going to pay for things I'll never use.
Well many of them are just like regular housing communities and you wouldn't know the difference except that the average age is older. And they do have a lot of art studios and studio space on site with all sorts of various art forms avaialbe to use (they have them listed under the clubs and recreation section as well as a gazzillion other groups and activities listed). I think any condo complex - especially when it's a large one like the place my Mom lived in has all one story places with only a few condos hooked together and lots of greenbelt space between that is spread out over several hundred acres - is going to have amenities that you might not use. I know most apts and condos I have looked at have at least a pool, spa and some sort of rec room or gym. So maybe you'd be better off getting a house with an extra room for your art work. Or maybe put a workshop on the property.
Another idea, if you don't need to rely on a job for income, is living in a resort type community. I lived in a mountain ski resort town for years and there are usually lots of available small houses and cabins that you can get very low cost. There are usually thriving art communities in town as well as an influx of tourists wanting to buy locally made products and art. You can rent out your place as a seasonal vacation rental for extra moo-lah if you want. And usually the slow seaon can be very nice with just locals around providing for a very tight knit community.
Another thing to think about is not only the cost of buying, but of property taxes and utilities - especially if you are on a fixed income. I know you are in NH and the heating costs can be expensive (there is another thread on this board about that). Same with having to hire someone to shovel snow or do yardwork if you own a house. Things you don't have to worry about if you rent an apt or buy a condo or co-op. But the cost of intreasing rents can become too much overtime. Just think where rents have gone over the last 20 or 30 years. Back in the late 60's my parents rented 3 bedroom house in southern Calif for $80/month. 30 plus years later rents for the same place was over $2500/month.
But it is in Oklahoma Crystal.cow-hi
Seriously, I was a third-generation Californian. It had never occurred to me to leave my home state. But I saw a chart in the Tightwad Gazette that ranked states by cost of living vs. average wage. I was startled to see that the average wage wasn't that much less in OK than in CA, but the cost of living was much less. This got me thinking. Two more obstacles presented. One was leaving family and friends, and that has been very hard. The other is kind of an odd one. Living in Southern California is like living in Paris or New York. There is a kind of cache' attached to it. If you live elsewhere, you may rightly scoff. But it was very real among people I knew. I took a two-day outplacement workshop with some ex-employees of the L.A. Times. When I said I was thinking of moving to Oklahoma, they said, "Oh no! You will not be happy there. THEY are very different from US." It was a little weird. I had to think through some of the attitudes and beliefs to come to my own peace with moving somewhere affordable. Would I be happy somewhere where "everyone" else had different political views? Would many people be prejudiced? And there were other concerns. California has mountains and beaches. I would miss those, wouldn't I? Since I was too busy working to visit those mountains and beaches very often, maybe not. Turns out Oklahoma has lakes and rivers and trees. Works for me. What I'm trying to say is that there are trade-offs. You have to give some thought to whether you will be happy with your losses and your gains, and don't BS yourself. I am pretty happy here. I'd have to say the biggest adjustment has had to do with getting used to retirement. My job was fast-paced and stressful. I didn't have energy for much after work. Deciding what I want to be now that I've graduated has been a biggie.
[QUOTE=CrystalAdmin;4645] One was leaving family and friends, and that has been very hard. The other is kind of an odd one. Living in Southern California is like living in Paris or New York. There is a kind of cache' attached to it. If you live elsewhere, you may rightly scoff. But it was very real among people I knew.
QUOTE]
I also find this to be true about living in SoCal. That along with the seemly endless quest by many people to achieve a great deal of material wealth and success for the sake of appearances. As well as the idea amongst people I know that one will only find true happiness in SoCal - land of endless sun and beautiful people. If it weren't for family, I would also be living elsewhere. I'm constantly dealing with the lure of other places - cheaper nicer places IMHO - and staying here to be close to my sister. I'm currently in that tug of war and it certainly is a big factor (the only factor) in keeping me here. Don't know what I'll do yet!! So, for the OP, that's another thing to consider - how close (or far ;)) from family do you want to be?
I'm casting about for a living situation myself, and a well-planned geezer community is beginning to sound pretty good to me. I'd LOVE to have swimming pools, gyms, activity centers (art studio!), biking/hiking paths and the like readily available. And inclusive home maintenance? Priceless! My partner would be in extrovert heaven in a place like that, as well. Must Google...
Dharma Bum
1-19-11, 1:23pm
I've always wanted to live an adult dorm. A small dorm room in college was fine because you had plenty of places to go and, more importantly, people to do things with. Wouldn't mind a cafeteria so you don't have to cook. And my room had its own bath so that wasn't an issue either. Maybe a retirement community would be close to that.
I've always wanted to live an adult dorm. A small dorm room in college was fine because you had plenty of places to go and, more importantly, people to do things with. Wouldn't mind a cafeteria so you don't have to cook. And my room had its own bath so that wasn't an issue either. Maybe a retirement community would be close to that.
Well the retirement communities I looked at with my Mom where are like regular houses or condos with full size kitchens, one or two or three bedrooms, one or two bfull bathrooms, living room, etc... Many had big front and back fenced in yards, allowed pets, had 2 car garages, driveways to park the boat or RV and usually storage sheds. The co-op my Mom lived in, and others I looked at, where like regular condos or patio homes with one or two bedrooms, big kitchen, living room, big bathroom, a large enclosed front porch, a big front garden, a storage shed on the patio and one in the covered carport. Basicly just like living in a regular place. They weren't a nursing home or assisted living place in that they don't provide meals or care in anyway. As a matter of fact, since most of the seniors places are considered "independent" living communities, you are required to get a note from you doctor saying you can live independently in order to move in. I think what you are talking about is an apt type community where you have a little studio room for yourself but have to go to a dining area to eat your meals. Where they have weekly housekeeping and someone to help with daily tasks if needed. I know those place are around but mostly for people who need some kind of assistance. Althoug I'm with you on the dorm room kind of life! I could see myself in a tiny place wher all my basic needs where provided for and all I needed to do all day was play and play and play!!! Gosh dern seniors have all the best places ;-)!
I'm casting about for a living situation myself, and a well-planned geezer community is beginning to sound pretty good to me. I'd LOVE to have swimming pools, gyms, activity centers (art studio!), biking/hiking paths and the like readily available. And inclusive home maintenance? Priceless! My partner would be in extrovert heaven in a place like that, as well. Must Google...
And don't forget you can drive your little electric golf cart around the community too! They even have plac es like that for the young - big party places. My step-sister and her DH lived in a place called Canyon Lake, CA. which is an upscale gated community with all the amenities. Everyone drives their pimped out and VERY outragous golf carts around, hitting the clubhouse for nights of drinking and debauchery. My step-sister even got a DUI in her golf cart - whichg was jacked up with hot pink flames all over it. Crazy place! Edited to add: the place they owned (their retirerment home even though they were only 50 when they bought) was a giant 5 bedroom, 4 bath, 4 car garage, McMansion on a huge lot for just the 2 of them. Had room for the boats, RVs and pimp mobile (golf cart) though!
Drunken golf cart driving? :0! I found a lovely place near Olympia that would be absolutely perfect (we actually spotted it on an outing once, and SO thought it was faboo) except that you can't actually buy property there. You have to commit yourself to a lifetime lease.
http://www.panoramacity.org
It has a perfect location (on Puget Sound), perfect setting, all the amenities you could imagine (indoor pool, arts and language classes, wilderness area, a theater...), but that's a huge sticking point. I'm leaning toward the idea of some kind of self-contained community at this moment in time. Tomorrow, who knows.
I've always wanted to live an adult dorm. A small dorm room in college was fine because you had plenty of places to go and, more importantly, people to do things with. Wouldn't mind a cafeteria so you don't have to cook. And my room had its own bath so that wasn't an issue either. Maybe a retirement community would be close to that.
We've seen our friend's father's place. He's got a double unit, a LR/kitchen area plus separate bedroom. All of his meals are provided. This is all for $36,000 annually which I think is a great deal. I think this includes some simple laundry.
I don't know why anyone really needs more space than this if one's hobbies and interests could be served in other spaces. People in big cities live in far less space than this.
But that's what bugs me about the retirement communities--they are not in a city center.
There was one old hotel downtown here that catered to retirees. I thought that was cool, a big old hotel with classic high-ceilinged rooms, once grand (and now a little shabby, but still nice) public parlours, in the middle of downtown. Unfortunately it closed.
sweetana3
1-20-11, 12:07pm
Location is something we look for. If it takes a car each time to even get to a walking spot, then it is not "convenient". Luckily we have some really well located senior complexs. One is a block from the library, grocery, Whole Food, Target, Post office, etc.
One set of senior apartment with four locations, runs a daily bus shuttle service with regular stops for shopping, etc.
One low income and senior building is right downtown around the corner from our house. One bedroom apts. are $350-490 per month in a nicely renovated building. We looked into it for mominlaw. We are trying to balance convenience for us (since we will have to do more for her in our city) and access to social events with senior groups which she might find easier in a larger community.
Senior housing comes in the full spectrum of services and costs. The absolute hardest thing is nursing home care needs with no or very little income.
In my survey yesterday of PNW retirement communities, I happened across facilities in downtown Portland, Seattle, and Redmond, FWIW.
The one in Olympia is near Evergreen College and has transportation options including buses to downtown Olympia. Several of the places I reviewed were impressive--on paper, at least. I was really taken by the emphasis on arts and outdoor activities.
I think if you are looking at a seniors/retirement apt complex you can find a lot of them smack in the center of most towns. I know that in downtown Long Beach, CA there are tons of them - everything from regular apts to renovated hotels with full services for seniors. Those places are expensive though. The big complexes with the individual homes or single story patio home condos with golf courses, big greenbelts and all the spread out amenities are usually more outside of town though. But, like the place my mom lived, Leisure World in Seal Beach, Ca., she was pretty much in the city. Just a couple of miles from downtown Long Beach or Seal Beach on a bus line. So it just depends on where you look. And because that place doesn't have any kind of care facilities or provide any old-age assitance, it is fairly inexpensive to live there. Much cheaper than a similair condo complex in the area - both to buy into the place (can sell it when you move or die just like a regular condo or house) and for monthly association dues. And although it has an on site medical center with a bunch of doctors, pharmamcy, etc.. so you can do your Dr's visits there (they except most insurance policies) instead of having to drive far away, it doesn't have any long term care or nursing home facilities so you'd have to go elsewhere for that.
edited to add: My mom bought her place (www.lwsb.com) for $27K in 1996 and after she died we sold it for $96K in 2008 (was valued at $140K a year earlier before the housing bust). Her monthly associaion dues were under $200 including her prop. taxes. She only paid for electric.
http://www.panoramacity.org
This is the kind of place I'd like too if it wasn't one of those countinuing care places with a "life Lease". I would want a place that I bought - and could sell if needed - as I thnk these CCC are way too expensive and you may never need all the services they offer for care. But it sure was pretty!
My folks live in a retirement community that offers both options. They have a two bedroom cottage with a garage, bigger than my house. But you can also stay in a smaller one bedroom apartment, with less responsibility for your home. Assuming you're still in good health and able to drive or wish to participate in the on and off "campus" activities, it seems pretty much ideal ... whenever I visit them I get to stay in one of the apartments and I spend most of my time thinking how nice and Easy it is. Of course it's also freakin' Expensive. The thing I like least: they've decided that in order to make offering meals financially feasible, everyone has to buy a meal plan. It comes with wait service, cloth napkins, the works. But frankly the food isn't great, not what I'd choose to eat, and the monthly cost is something like $1,000 per person. For $1,000 I could eat in a real restaurant with actual ethnic food or make myself lobster at home every night.
So that's the rub, for me: while a lot of stuff is taken care of for you, you lose control of some decisions, some of which might be quite important to you (or your wallet).
Oh yeah ... and everybody in the community dies. Also sort of a downer.
cost is something like $1,000 per person.
Yep for that price I could eat out 3 meals a day and hire Brad Pitt as my personal waiter! Yeah, those places that have the "full service" amenities (meals, housekeeping, caretakers, etc...) are way to expensive IMHO. Especially if you don't use those amenities. I'd mauch rather stay in a nice hotel for the price of those places - and I know you would too KIB :-)!
Oh yeah ... and everybody in the community dies. Also sort of a downer.
Less people equals more dessert for me! ;-)!
Going back to the OP's original question. Another option is buying an inexpensive mobile home and some land somewhere. Lots of places with utilities and septic in already just waiting for you to put down a mobile or manufactured home. Or you could find one that's already on the land. And while the mobile home will probably decrease in value, the land will (usually) increase in value. Where as if you lived in a park, you probably wouldn't see any appreciation at all but would see possible increases in your monthly space rent. Space rent that often goes to pay for those things you don't want like pools, gyms and rec room. Most of those parks are also on 30 year leases, and when the lease is up the owner can force everyone to move out so they can turn it into something else. That has happened alot in several beach communities in SoCal. Several mobile home parks have forced out all the residents (and forced them to move their mobiles too) once the parks lease was up. Then the owner sold the land to a developer for a gazzilion dollars, then the developer built houses or hotels or shopping on that space. The residents who were kicked out of the park were often long term tenents who were elderly on very limited fixed incomes and no money to move their mobiles to somewhere new. Good reason to put a mobile on your own land rather than a park if you can.
It occurs to me that I've upgraded my Perfect Simple Life model from hotel to all-inclusive resort. :cool:
Yep for that price I could eat out 3 meals a day and hire Brad Pitt as my personal waiter! Yeah, those places that have the "full service" amenities (meals, housekeeping, caretakers, etc...) are way to expensive IMHO. Especially if you don't use those amenities. I'd mauch rather stay in a nice hotel for the price of those places - and I know you would too KIB :-)!Yep. If I really think about it, $1,000 a month isn't insane, because they're basically eating in a restaurant every night. $30 for a meal with "tax and tip" included, salad bar, soup, main course, non-alc bevs and dessert isn't terrible. But I have to wonder if all the residents really had the budget to be eating in a restaurant every night when this was foisted on them. It's a nice place but it's not a palace. What really would worry me about a situation like this isn't the food per se, it's the idea that these decisions are taken out of your hands. For those of us who have been number crunching and budget managing for years, that would be pretty disturbing. They paid in a lot of money upfront to be in this place, so they can't really leave. I think I'd definitely rather live in a decent hotel with a real restaurant. Or as Jane said, maybe a resort ... senior cruise, anyone?
And fewer people does equal more dessert, but I'm wondering if it's the most socially healthy situation to be with only people your own age - and controlled by others. Sort of like being back in elementary school.
The reason there are so many different choices of community is that there are so many ideas of what constitutes a great community. I have met several who live in continuing care communities (one was 84 on an Elderhostel trip) and loved where they lived. They felt it removed so much many problematic areas of their lives. A couple hated to cook and buy food and the in house dining gave them an easy solution with meals appropriate to their health status.
There is no right or wrong, only a spectrum of choices.
"And fewer people does equal more dessert, but I'm wondering if it's the most socially healthy situation to be with only people your own age - and controlled by others. Sort of like being back in elementary school. "
Indeed. I'm not easily herded, and I don't have much taste for institutional meals. (I'm not sure a 55-105 age cohort would bother me as much.) And as profligate as I can be, I consider $1000 a month for food a jaw-dropping figure. I've thought and thought about future living possibilities, and I can't say I've had any Eureka! moments. I can't even settle on a state...
iris lily
1-21-11, 11:16pm
Our friend keeps saying this: why don't we all get together in retirement to take care of each other!??? There is a group of us all born in 1954 who are close freinds. And then, there is another group on either side of this year. And sure, I'm in. but he keeps talking about moving to the country and I just will not do that. And I can't see how he's interested in the country, either--he likes moveis and plays and restuarants, cant' get THAT out in the sticks--WHY MUST WE MOVE TO THE COUNTRY TO DO THIS!!!???? wanh. He's not given me a good answer, and beside, his partner hates Missouri weather so they would go to Arizonia for 6 months out of the year. But we still talk about it.
Iris Lily, that's a great idea..I read, a while back, about a group of friends who purchased their own small apartment building in a city--might have been NYC..and loved it...made the rules to suit themselves, traded pet-sitting and such...I love the idea.
What draws me is the idea of buying a gracious old country manse to share and have an organic garden...
My parents retired to a 55 plus community in FL and I found it very depressing to visit there--I'm not a big fan of age-segregation. In my little town, my friends span a 25 year spread and I like that. Different viewpoints are stimulating...and yes, someone was always dying in my parent's development...seeing that ambulance come all the time and wondering for whom...yuck...just my viewpoint...no offense to anyone.
HappyHiker, We visit friends in FL on the Gulf side in a 55+ community. They love it, but they said it does get depressing, they spend a lot of time looking after each other in their neighborhood, running to the hospital weekly to see some neighbor or another. Hear an ambulance go by almost nightly. But he also pointed out that rarely would anyone die and not be found till weeks later - everyone keeps their eye out for everyone. He calls FL "Heaven's waiting room".
I live in a 55+ retirement community in FL :-) Hubby and I are only 50 (we've been here 5 years) and I can say that we almost never see an ambulance in here. The first few years there were almost no deaths -- maybe one a year-- but the last two have been harder. I can tell you this -- we have a VERY active community and they run circles around us. They are always on our golf course, in the pool, walking, going on trips -- I get tired just thinking about it all! They enjoy it SO much!
We have only 273 lots in our community, so it's very small and intimate, compared to others here. It's out in the country, yet only 25 minutes to Disney and equidistant between Orlando and Tampa. We are 90 minutes from either coast.
I love it here, but my house is for sale. We have only one grandchild, and her family is moving to Texas in a few months and I don't want to be apart from her. I love my house -- it's just going to be in the wrong state :-)
https://sites.google.com/site/cypressgreenshomeforsale/
It's been in the upper 70's here through the last week. Our upcoming weather is around the 70 degree mark for the next several days. Simply gorgeous.
Becky
I live in a 55+ retirement community in FL :-) Hubby and I are only 50 (we've been here 5 years) and I can say that we almost never see an ambulance in here. The first few years there were almost no deaths -- maybe one a year-- but the last two have been harder. I can tell you this -- we have a VERY active community and they run circles around us. They are always on our golf course, in the pool, walking, going on trips -- I get tired just thinking about it all! They enjoy it SO much!
We have only 273 lots in our community, so it's very small and intimate, compared to others here. It's out in the country, yet only 25 minutes to Disney and equidistant between Orlando and Tampa. We are 90 minutes from either coast.
I love it here, but my house is for sale. We have only one grandchild, and her family is moving to Texas in a few months and I don't want to be apart from her. I love my house -- it's just going to be in the wrong state :-)
https://sites.google.com/site/cypressgreenshomeforsale/
It's been in the upper 70's here through the last week. Our upcoming weather is around the 70 degree mark for the next several days. Simply gorgeous.
Becky
This is how it is a my Mom's place too. Everyone is super active and always out and about doing way more stuff than most people. Her next door neighbor spent 6 months a year in their 4 x 4 camper travelling thru Mexico and Central America each year. Another neighbor worked full time as a university teacher and spent his free time in his vaction home in Palm Springs playing golf and tennis all day long. Another neighbor spent half the year backpacking in the Pac NW and elsewhere around the world each year, and yet another neighbor owned a home and race horses in Carmel, CA. and went to races all over the country. Everyone is out walking, running, bike riding, surfing, golfing, etc... Seems like they are all fromn that movie "Cocoon". many of the people are in their mid-50's and still work full time and have very active social lives. Always something going on. The guy who bought my Mom's place was a long haired ragged "simple living" surfer dude of 55 who retired early and just wanted a small place that was inexpensive and easy to care for so he could spend his days at the beach surfing. My kind of guy! I personally think there is more interesting people, and more variety of people and lifestyle, in those places than a regular neighborhood where everyone is working 9 to 5 during the week and cutting the lawn on the weekends. Suburbia (and I've lived there) always reminds me of the 'hood from "Edward Scissorhands" - boring, mundane, predictable, and everyone doing the same thing and looking the same way. Those seniors places have a lot more variety IMHO!
I have my retirement home and it is has wheels. It is a 48 passenger school bus I am in process of converting into a camper. I have 191 watts of solar panels that will be mounted on hinged frames on the roof. I am installing a composting toilet. I will also have solar heat and solar water heater.Other than the expenses of food and gas and regular maintenance my expenses will be very low. I also plan to play Johnny Appleseed with flower and veggie gardens wherever I can get away with it. whether I cross that path again or not. The gardens will go to seed and with luck grow back the next season. The bus has minor repairing needed a starter and brakes bled. Replace headlights and a few mirrors and it is ON the road.This is my retirement home.
I have my retirement home and it is has wheels. It is a 48 passenger school bus I am in process of converting into a camper. I have 191 watts of solar panels that will be mounted on hinged frames on the roof. I am installing a composting toilet. I will also have solar heat and solar water heater.Other than the expenses of food and gas and regular maintenance my expenses will be very low. I also plan to play Johnny Appleseed with flower and veggie gardens wherever I can get away with it. whether I cross that path again or not. The gardens will go to seed and with luck grow back the next season. The bus has minor repairing needed a starter and brakes bled. Replace headlights and a few mirrors and it is ON the road.This is my retirement home.
Very cool! Do you plan to put it somewhere permanent (land or RV park) to travel around in it? I know that there are tons of BLM land where you can boondock (i.e. stay for free) as long as you want bu they don't have any amenities. Have you ever checked out "Slab City" in Southern Calif? One of the former members here (simply Gib) stays there each year for a month or 2 in winter and it sounds like a very eclectic (i.e. totally bizzaro but cool) place. Google Slab City to see what I mean!
The question I have for you - and any full time RVer - is what kind of arrangements do you plan to make as you get older and maybe disabled or infirm? I know other members on this board like Loosechickens and hubby own some land for their RV in a place they can "age out" (not that Loosechickens will EVER get old :-)!!) and Laura and Sasha are still young so probably aren't concerned about it yet, but that would be a be something I would worry about once I was older if I did the full time RV thing.
I DON'T ever want to live in an "over 55" community, with all due respect to those that do. Why segment yourself from the larger community? I'm 59, and still live in the home I raised my 4 children in--just across the park from the school, which I watched them walk to every day. There's a baseball field right behind my backyard (it was very "Field-of-Dreams-esque" when I looked out my kitchen window one day and they were building it!), and I really enjoy watching the kids come and play ball there. The little kids two doors down come and play with my dog, and I ask them about their chickens.
As I get older, not sure, but I want to free up some home equity for cash in the bank. I haven't thought deeply about it frankly. Maybe I'll stay right here in Central Jersey, where I'm really close to good hospitals and I feel ties with my community--but we don't really need a family home anymore. We've thought about moving to Vermont, and I've also thought about moving to a particular town on the Jersey Shore--one that is adorable and protected by the Historic Landmark Trust and is super walkable. "Walkable" is a big criterion for me.
My dream? To buy a little portable Tumbleweed House and park it at each of my 4 kids' houses 3 months out of the year.
we have a small home (approx 1400 sq ft heated) built in the 90's. Easy to maintain, fairly cheap to heat and cool. It is located about 2-6 miles from two small towns. All good and what we want for retirement except for one thing. The yard is really hard to keep up. We live on the side of a mountain, steep driveway and most of the lawn work is weedeating. Husband is 58 and we started hiring some part-time help with the yard work, but who knows how long we'll be able to pay for help? Worries me sometimes, the thought of being left here alone, or my daughter being here alone with such a hard lawn to deal with.
shadowmoss
5-19-11, 5:51pm
Spartana: The Escapees group has a program called CARE that is an adult day-care system for people who can still live in their RV's but need extra help due to illness or injury or age. That is one plan I'm looking at, and one reason I'm hoping to go full-time in an RV as my long-term post-work plan.
Spartana: The Escapees group has a program called CARE that is an adult day-care system for people who can still live in their RV's but need extra help due to illness or injury or age. That is one plan I'm looking at, and one reason I'm hoping to go full-time in an RV as my long-term post-work plan.
That's good to know. I imagine you can't be a boondocker, living for free out in the wilderness, and probably have to be able to stay in one place (RV Park) long term and be able to pay for that as well as the cost for the program. But that's probably less expensive than a traditional in-home caretaker. And if it is chronic thing, you'd probably have to go to a nursing home or be taken in by family just like you would if you owned a house. However, I know that if you own a home and need to go to a nursing home for care (either long term or short term) and need to use Medicaid to fund that, they won't take your home to pay for it until you are dead or unable to ever live at home again, but they might take your RV as an asset to pay for your care. Then, once released from the nursing home, you might not have anywhere to live. Something to think about - or at least research further if you (or anyone) is planning to RV full time into their old age.
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