Househunters - overbuying

[jp1]

This is really just a rant since I know we've discussed this before plenty of times, but it's been 24 hours since I watched and I'm still thinking about it, so I just have to say, the people we saw yesterday were such idiots. Possibly the biggest idiots I've ever seen in all the years I've been watching the show. And as often as the show is on, and all the idiots I've seen, that's saying something.

They had a budget of $650k. They needed something big enough for themselves, their kids, the wife's widowed mother, space for the wife to operate a daycare center, and enough room to entertain 30+ extended local family members on a regular basis. (which made me wonder if all the other familymembers also have such big houses to entertain in or are these people paying for a giant space for everyone else to always come hang out at...) The first house was in budget but at only 4,700 feet it wasn't big enough, in the wife's opinion. They ended up buying a brand new house at a budget busting $792k!!! Well over $100k of the price was 'upgrades'. God help them if the husband gets laid off from his job. They'll be behind on the mortgage the next month.

I just don't get it. The kitchen/family room area of the house was bigger than a medium sized banquet hall. The master bedroom was probably as big as our entire apartment with a huge sitting area and a walk-in closet that was big enough to hold half the women's section of Macy's Herald Square store. I can't imagine going that far into debt, not to mention the housework, maintenance and utilities involved in caring for such a massive space. And for me, even if I had as much wealth as Bill Gates, I wouldn't want anywhere near such a big space. I'm quite happy in our 'cozy' 1200 sq foot apartment, and if I were to find myself single again I'd definitely downsize quite a bit from this since part of the reason we want this much space is so SO can be down in the living room watching tv while I'm up here in the den listening to the Avett Brothers and griping about people who think they need a monstrously big house to be happy. I probably wouldn't go back to a 250 sq foot apartment like I had before I met SO, but definitely well under 1,000, possibly under 500. Even in my tiny NYC apartment I was able, with a little creativity, to have 5 or 6 people over for big meals on thanksgiving or christmas several times, and 15-20 people over for happy hour-type beer tastings (I was home brewing at the time), so I don't think it's necessary to have a 6,000 sq foot house in order to be able to entertain friends and family.

/rant. Thanks for listening.

[Wildflower]

I saw that show too, and like you I couldn't believe it!! Nothing less would do for that woman, even though they couldn't afford it!

I did read recently though that those House Hunter shows are scripted from beginning to end, so who even knows if any of it is for real....

I personally love small houses. My own house is around 1250 square feet. It is big enough for DH and I each to have some space, and I have room for overnight guests with a second bedroom and bathroom. My DD and grandkids come visit from out of town often, so I needed space for them to stay in. Otherwise, we could live in a much smaller space and there are days I think that would be really nice. I so love that cozy cottage style of decorating too. So comforting to me, what home is all about....

[jp1]

I imagine that every 'reality' show is heavily scripted. And my understanding is that to be on househunters you have to be in escrow, so yeah, the damage was done before that couple ever got on the show, but still, I'm sure the reality is that they bought a house that was at the very very edge of what they could afford and left no margin for error in budgeting.

Thinking, though, about out of town visitors and such. I can remember being a kid and going to visit my maternal grandmother, or a couple of very favorite aunts and uncles and having it be a super-deluxe treat to be invited to sleep in a sleeping bag on the floor of their bedroom. As a kid this is what I was told, and I totally believed it. (and as a little kid also really wanted to get to do it because these were people I absolutely adored and wanted to be with as much as possible, even while asleep.) In hindsight I"m sure part of it was that there was nowhere else for me to sleep because we're talking 1,000 sq foot houses with one unused bedroom and not 7,000 sq foot houses, but at the time I bought into the story that I was "special enough" to be allowed to do so, and have fond memories of it. Or of our 'guest bedroom' throughout my childhood, which was an old sleeper sofa in the middle of our unfinished basement. The space wasn't glamorous, but it was private enough, and heck, since it was in the basement it was even a cool spot in summer, or relatively warm in winter since the furnace was nearby. The idea that we all need a fancy guest room, or multiple rooms, reserved just for that use, is a relatively new idea for most people.

[Zoebird]

my guests sleep on air mattresses in the lounge, or the bed that DS will use when he's ready. Or both. Everybody is happy. :)

[Wildflower]

My granddaughter sleeps on the sofa in the living room and my grandson sleeps in a sleeping bag on the floor in our bedroom (which he loves). My DD and SIL appreciate sleeping in a real bed though, and they are here for long stretches of time often. Once a month usually, but they come for a week each month in the summertime. I am especially thankful for our 2nd bathroom during these visits. :)

Our second bedroom, however, is not just a guest room - it really is a multi-purpose room, that I probably wouldn't want to give up....sewing room, craft room, library, dog crates room, desk/paperwork/computer room, etc. I could live without the 2nd bathroom though, but it certainly is convenient at times, even when it is just me and DH there.... :)

[sweetana3]

I gave away the bed in the second bedroom so I could expand my crafting area. Now if people feel the need to come stay with us, it is the big sofa in the living room.

[ctg492]

I no longer watch the show for all the reasons mentioned. I feel no obligation if someone came to spend the night.

[peggy]

When my kids were little they slept on the sofa and the guests slept in their beds. Now, we do have guest rooms, but like others have mentioned, serve as multi purpose rooms. We could definitely downsize, but our place has everything else we love, so a big house is just part of the package.

When I was little, visiting relatives was always so much fun BECAUSE we kids, cousins young and old, would all lay out our sleeping bags and pallets on the floor (living room, den) and have a giant sleep-over party. What fun! That was always the best part!

[catherine]

Yes, definitely I have a love/hate relationship with all the shows on HGTV like Househunters. I saw one the other day where a young couple--must have been around 25, were looking for a home in Hawaii. Their budget was 850,000. She claimed to be a go-with-the-flow yoga person, but she had to live at least 1,000 feet above sea level, he had to have spectacular ocean views.

They saw three AMAZING properties. But she didn't like the "outdated" look of one of them.. hey, I didn't see any paneled walls or macrame wall-hangings, or appliances in Avocado Green, so how can it be outdated? Really, I do think advertisers are messaging to watchers that if it's older than 10 years, you just have to junk it and replace it with newer and better. So aggravating!! (BTW, my house still has paneling (which we painted over) and it still has 70s appliances. I'm so happy I saved money updating in the 80s, otherwise I'd have a lot of rose-colored floral wallpaper to get rid of)

The patio alone on one of these houses was bigger than my house. However, with all due respect to the yoga girl, she did question her husband when they saw a basement area that was about 2200 square feet, "do we need all this space?" To which he replied, "But honey, you can conduct your yoga classes here!" (She's THINKING of starting a yoga studio someday).

So they bought the house. I just want to know where do 20 somethings get all that money???

[SteveinMN]

The patio alone on one of these houses was bigger than my house. However, with all due respect to the yoga girl, she did question her husband when they saw a basement area that was about 2200 square feet, "do we need all this space?" To which he replied, "But honey, you can conduct your yoga classes here!" (She's THINKING of starting a yoga studio someday).
If they're always entertaining 2-3 dozen people, maybe they really do need a large house. That would not be my idea of a good time. But if they can afford it...

But that kind of "overbuying" is not limited to houses. Guys here buy these monster two-stage snowblowers for the maybe two or three times a winter when you need something with that kind of power. It's overkill for 90% of the snowfall we get here. And if I had a dollar for every forum post/craigslist ad/conversation I've encountered that went something like, "I have to sell my <reasonable vehicle> and buy an SUV because we're having another kid [making a grand total of four or five in the family]" I would be able to buy my own SUV. Buy an SUV because you go offroad a lot; buy an SUV because you tow a trailer and still need to move family members. But don't kid yourself that you're getting more room inside than a minivan or even a larger car -- because you're not. And I wish people would stop kidding themselves that SUVs are better in the snow and ice here. A good set of winter tires and some actual winter driving skill will get you far further.


So they bought the house. I just want to know where do 20 somethings get all that money???
I've long wondered that myself. Maybe it's the Bank of Mom and Dad. But I suspect most people have an optimism about their future earning power that leaves them comfortable mortgaging themselves to the hilt. How that affects their ability to save for their own calamities of life or old age remains a mystery. Or maybe it isn't.

[Mrs-M]

I lost interest in the show due to the chronic small-mindedness, shallowness, and materialist ways of so many of the buyers. However, I find comfort knowing nearly all of the large homes I see on television nowadays, look gaudy. Gaudy, to the point of tacky. So cheaply done.

It's not about living, it's about putting on a show.

P.S. Catherine. One of the things I love about you most, is your down-to-earth realness. There aren't many of you left in this world.

[Float On]

I didn't know that show was still making episodes. I've only seen it when staying in hotels or for awhile my dad had that channel on his dish service.
I have watched (maybe 3 or 4 years ago) some episodes of the international one on Hulu. I found those most interesting because it was American buyers with all their high expectations being shocked at how small or different properties were. So many would end up buying in an "American settlement" and I wondered what was the point of trying to experience life in a different culture if you ended up in something that was a bubble environment of what you'd come from.

[iris lily]

OMG I love HH International! I watch episodes on YouTube. I cant' get HULU shows to play on my computer.

I just wish I could find the British version of HH. DH and I watched it, spellbound, each morning when we were last in the UK. That HH show did not focus on boring new construction but always seemed to have the buyer choose between 3 quaint historic properties.

[Mrs-M]

Originally posted by Iris Lily.
I just wish I could find the British version of HH. DH and I watched it, spellbound, each morning when we were last in the UK. That HH show did not focus on boring new construction but always seemed to have the buyer choose between 3 quaint historic properties.Yes, I've watched the British version, too, and agree, it focuses on people in search of a gem. Nothing like the US version, which, IMO, is a total turnoff.

[JaneV2.0]

My favorite HH episodes almost always feature urban condos because they're often contemporary--whether here or abroad. And single or childless buyers. On those shows, at least, people with families usually buy boring, run-of-the-mill places (subjective, I know).

[jennipurrr]

If I ever have that kind of a budget for a home, god help me if I am still having to run an in home day care for extra money. Maybe she loves it or something but I would rather have a smaller home and scrap that side business.

DH and I were watching a version of the show the other day called House Hunters Renovation. It was fairly ricidulous as the couple wanted to do renovations on all kinds of perfectly nice and functional (not outdated at all) homes. DH was getting riled up about it, but they chose a house that needed true renovation and it turned out pretty nicely. I have heard they have the house already bought and they just go back and look at two other ones, so that makes sense with this show. I guess they had to imagine up what renovations they would have done to these houses that didn't really need any.

Sometimes I like those shows and sometimes I think the people on them are just nuts. I even tried to find out how to be on Love It or List It since we are struggling whether to sell the house or stay and it seems like those people get a total house redo out of the deal for free...but apparently it is a Canadian show they are just rerunning in the States, oh well.

[Mrs-M]

Originally posted by Jennipurrr.
DH and I were watching a version of the show the other day called House Hunters Renovation. It was fairly ricidulous as the couple wanted to do renovations on all kinds of perfectly nice and functional (not outdated at all) homes.This is the biggest turnoff for me. I find myself asking myself, "what kind of upbringing did these people have where wastefulness, was so strongly promoted in their lives".

[catherine]

So many would end up buying in an "American settlement" and I wondered what was the point of trying to experience life in a different culture if you ended up in something that was a bubble environment of what you'd come from.

I agree.. I remember when I was traveling for business to Stockholm and the project manager I was traveling with was just absolutely horrified that her hotel room had a twin bed. She almost refused to stay there.

I think one of the reasons I've taken to permaculture so heartily is because it's a good social balance for me between my work and non-work life. I have my acquaintances who think experiencing hardship is sitting in the last row of a 747 bound for Europe, and I have acquaintances who need very few creature comforts at all.

[Gardenarian]

I've never seen the show, but if I had a budget of $650,000 for a house, I would still buy the least expensive house that met my needs...In line with the "money makes you crazy thread"...just because you have $650K doesn't mean you need to spend it. Find a nice little place for $200K and retire!

As to beds - I've always like the American Indian saying "If your bed is too soft, you won't want to get up in the morning" or something to that effect.

[Gregg]

I've long wondered that myself. Maybe it's the Bank of Mom and Dad. But I suspect most people have an optimism about their future earning power that leaves them comfortable mortgaging themselves to the hilt. How that affects their ability to save for their own calamities of life or old age remains a mystery. Or maybe it isn't.

There is some anecdotal evidence that seems to show how banking on the future in that way can work against you.

[lhamo]

I don't know if the domestic version works the same way, but the HOuse Hunters International show is a complete recreation. They were looking for people to profile in China a couple of years ago, soon after we bought our apartment, and I tried halfheartedly to talk DH into applying. The conditions they laid out were that you had to have bought your place within the last two years. From what I understand, they then "recreate" the search using the house you are already living in as one of the options, plus two other properties that are currently on the market -- most likely not ones you actually looked at while searching, since those are probably already sold! They give you $2500 in "hassle" money for using your space -- which may include moving all your stuff out so that the place looks vacant.

I'm still kind of sorry DH didn't agree to it, but maybe it is a good thing because if we had everyone on god's great earth would be finding fault with my obsession with the double ovens in our apartment!

lhamo

[Simpler at Fifty]

I came across this blog recently. So much of 'reality TV' is fake. This blog proves House Hunters is fake. Or at least this couple's story was.

http://westernwarmth.blogspot.com/2012/06/house-hunters-rest-of-story.html

[Dhiana]

I found those most interesting because it was American buyers with all their high expectations being shocked at how small or different properties were. So many would end up buying in an "American settlement" and I wondered what was the point of trying to experience life in a different culture if you ended up in something that was a bubble environment of what you'd come from.

+1
Sadly it is other Americans that give my husband and I a hard time for enjoying our little Japanese apt, for taking the time to learn the language, etc.

[Wildflower]

I think ALL of those HGTV shows are designed to make us feel bad about our own homes and thus feel the need to renovate, in other words - spend lots of money.

HGTV is just one very long advertisement....

Time to quit watching, I think! At least for me anyway.

[jp1]

I'm still kind of sorry DH didn't agree to it, but maybe it is a good thing because if we had everyone on god's great earth would be finding fault with my obsession with the double ovens in our apartment!

lhamo

SO and I joke about going on househunters all the time. In the end, though, I'd never ever do it. I'm sure our quirks and desires would cause plenty of sarcastic comments from viewers, just as we make when watching it.

[jp1]

I think ALL of those HGTV shows are designed to make us feel bad about our own homes and thus feel the need to renovate, in other words - spend lots of money.


I'm sure that's the point, but I must be immune. I just watch with fascination, and no small amount of disbelief, at the things people think they need to spend so much money on.

[Gregg]

I caught a few minutes of one of the new incarnations the other night....Island Hunters. I am totally serious. The couple was looking for an island in the Bahamas with a budget of $8-10 million. The realtor was showing them an island that was listed for $16 million, but they were thinking about it anyway. Not sure how it ended up, I flipped over to Jeopardy on the DVR.

[ToomuchStuff]

I know a Realtor who told me years ago, that Realtor's push people to the edge of their envelopes, as they expect their incomes will go up. I never asked if this was only first time home-buyers, or if there were ages involved, etc. I know that she and her husband were impressed and happy for me that my house was paid off. I now, get a second, hidden meaning from that, as she and her 80 year old husband, both work, and we all thought they did it, because they love what they do. They are losing their home.
As for tv, it isn't that much different from the paper, etc. They are self perpetuating items. They want you to pay them money, to advertise to you, so you go spend money on their products, then they charge those product manufacturers, more money, to target you, and the costs of those shows, go up, to which they come back and charge you more as a customer (both products and tv subscriptions) for.
Even the news is marketing (sensationalize, so you come back and watch us more).

There was one house locally, that a friend was the builder for, that the lot behind was bought as well, so the gymnasium roofline, would not be above the roofline of the rest of the house. Money can make things easier to acquire, but it doesn't equate to happiness. I've wondered what these mega houses are going to be worth, because when I was a kid, I was told there were more baby boomers then the next generation (some social security discussion I think I walked in on). I asked about the prices of falling houses, as their would be so many extra, to which I was told, houses go up in value (that didn't make sense then either).

[SteveinMN]

I know a Realtor who told me years ago, that Realtor's push people to the edge of their envelopes, as they expect their incomes will go up.
I know a few real estate agents and I don't doubt that that is sometimes true (though I have not asked them about this point-blank). RE agents are paid on commission, so a more expensive house equals a bigger payday for them. They're no different from any other commissioned salesperson in that respect.

I think that "push" may be happening less these days, though. The housing market has changed. It's much harder to get a mortgage now; pushing people to the limit of what they can borrow can end up in not getting approved and the sale falling through. Similarly, it used to be that you could get the appraisal to hit whatever number you wanted; no more. And I think many buyers were seduced by the idea that they could own the house a few years and sell it at a good profit, guaranteed. That's no longer true, either.

And, finally, at least in my area, there still are some very-low-priced short sales and foreclosures. Here in St. Paul, you'll see listings for 2-3 bedroom bungalows or story-and-a-halfs for $30,000. When people see prices like that, they go shopping. Buyers don't realize that such a house usually requires considerable spending to bring it up to a Certificate of Occupancy and that, unless they are skilled and licensed to DIY, they'll end up spending closer to $70-80,000 for the properties that don't require that kind of work. So a RE agent that guides buyers to a house that's ready for occupancy for that reason can be viewed (inaccurately) as "selling up".


I've wondered what these mega houses are going to be worth, because when I was a kid, I was told there were more baby boomers then the next generation (some social security discussion I think I walked in on).
Now that gasoline costs between $3 and $4 a gallon, people have started doing the math on living 20-30 miles away from work -- and having to hop into the car for anything as ordinary as getting a gallon of milk. Building in the outer tiers of the Twin Cities metro area has slowed down a lot. Between outright bankruptcy of a lot of developers and less of a will to pay the price to live in the treeless 'burbs, home sales have taken a dive and some developments may never be filled in our lifetimes.

[jp1]

And, finally, at least in my area, ... they'll end up spending closer to $70-80,000 for the properties that don't require that kind of work.

Good lord. For housing that cheap maybe SO and I need to relearn to love winter... Unfortunately we would both also have to realign our career paths to make Minnesota work for us.

[SteveinMN]

Good lord. For housing that cheap maybe SO and I need to relearn to love winter... Unfortunately we would both also have to realign our career paths to make Minnesota work for us.
The median house in the TC costs around $150-170,000, depending on who you listen to. These ultra-cheap houses happen to be houses which are largely 90-120 years old, maybe have a basement (usually an unfinished section for the furnace, etc.), maybe have a garage, and maybe have a backyard. 2-3 bedrooms, one tiny bath, probably some old knob-and-tube wiring in the attic yet. It's not that they're bad houses, but these houses are lower than market for good reasons even beyond the code-related and esthetic work that needs to be done. Now, if you could live in some of the dying towns outstate, then you probably could buy a house for $30-50,000. But then you're surrounded by the great outdoors and not much more.

[Gregg]

Now, if you could live in some of the dying towns outstate, then you probably could buy a house for $30-50,000. But then you're surrounded by the great outdoors and not much more.

In the small towns here in Nebraska that aren't close to Lincoln, Omaha or Interstate-80 it is VERY common to find nice, well kept homes for $50k. Often times they're being sold by heirs liquidating an estate. If you are willing to take on fixing up a house that has been neglected or has sat vacant for a while its not at all uncommon to find those for $5K. I know a guy who purchased two houses on 6 city lots for $1. The estate sold them to him because the heirs were living far away so couldn't manage rentals, couldn't find buyers and were tired of paying the taxes. It happens.